GUN FREE ZONES! Funny.

A friend sent this. A funny way to make a good point.

I try not to use businesses which post these signs and I hope you don’t either.

On that note, after Mass on Sunday a couple guys from the parish offered to take me to the range to stop some evil, nefarious paper.

One of the guys had a Smith Wesson .50 caliber revolver!

Good grief.

It was like shooting a small canon… no, that’s not quite right… a small cannon.

Nice flash.

On the back of the hat it says, “Verum, Bonum, Pulchrum”.  Yes, this is the hat of Wyoming Catholic College, where your students can’t have mobile phones, but they can have guns.

I shot well on Sunday.  Here is 15′, 25′, and 30′.  This was using a Sig P228 in 9mm, fairly quickly.  I put 5 rounds in each mag and then did a mag change at each distance.  At 30′ a few got away from me.

CLICK TO BUY

And while I am thinking of it, do you have this CD yet?

Last year the Benedictines of Mary, Queen of Apostles, in Missouri, released a great music CD of music for Advent.

It is still available!

There are zillions of Christmas music offerings out there.  Advent?  Not so much.

This disk can help you keep Advent as Advent.

Here are a few little samples.

The UK link is HERE and Canada HERE.

The sisters, the Benedictines of Mary, Queen of Apostles, were named Billboard magazine’s Classical Traditional Artist 2012 and 2013. It’s the first order of nuns to ever win an award in the history of Billboard magazine. The Sisters were recognized for their two bestselling albums, ANGELS AND SAINTS AT EPHESUS, which spent 13 consecutive weeks at No. 1 on Billboard’s Classical Traditional Music chart, and ADVENT AT EPHESUS, which spent six consecutive weeks at No. 1 on the same chart.  According to a recent press release, they bested a group of popular classical music artists to secure the award, including Andrea Bocelli and Sarah Brightman.

And former-Father Greg Reynolds is still excommunicated.

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About Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

Fr. Z is the guy who runs this blog. o{]:¬)
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58 Responses to GUN FREE ZONES! Funny.

  1. mamajen says:

    lol… I’ve been wondering if the “Repeal the SAFE Act” signs people have on their lawns here in NY deter criminals. I’ve thought about getting a sign even though I’m not a gun owner.

    My 5-year-old doesn’t really know about guns yet, but he has learned about cannons, and he thinks anything that shoots is called a cannon.

  2. Elizabeth D says:

    I am always comforted to see the “no guns” signs. I would like to see more churches put up such signs. Our trust is not on weaponry, stocks of food and water, money, or our own strength, but in the Lord.

  3. pelerin says:

    The video reminded me of the sign I saw outside a town some years ago which stated that ‘THIS TOWN IS IN A NUCLEAR FREE ZONE.’ A friend commented ‘what are they going to do about it – put a wall round it?’

    However at risk of offending Americans I have to say I fail to understand their insistance on the right to bear arms. Did not Our Lord say something about turning swords into ploughshares?

    Two items of news recently must have made Americans think about their so-called right. A sufferer from Altzheimers became confused, managed to leave his house and knocked on the door of someone in the vicinity in the middle of the night. The door was opened by someone with a gun who promptly shot the poor confused man dead. The other piece of news was that in one American state (I believe it was Ohio) blind people have already been allowed to posess a gun licence and they are now discussing whether to allow blind people to carry a gun outside. You could not make it up.

  4. incredulous says:

    “Oh the cellulosity! And all the redwoods screaming around here….”

    What did that pulp ever do to you to deserve such tight groupings, beloved Father?

    RE: the blind people carrying… go research some of the pros of this one from some legally blind netizens who are gun advocates… The arguments FOR it are quite convincing.

    And it’s hardly as absurd as Joe Biden’s advice to simply fire his shotgun through the door when he feels threatened…

  5. Geoffrey says:

    Elizabeth D: Amen!

  6. Scott W. says:

    Our trust is not on weaponry, stocks of food and water, money, or our own strength, but in the Lord.

    Respectfully, this is a false dilemma. Having the things above does not imply a distrust of the Lord. But don’t take my word for it. See the Catechism:

    2263 The legitimate defense of persons and societies is not an exception to the prohibition against the murder of the innocent that constitutes intentional killing. “The act of self-defense can have a double effect: the preservation of one’s own life; and the killing of the aggressor. . . . The one is intended, the other is not.”65

    2264 Love toward oneself remains a fundamental principle of morality. Therefore it is legitimate to insist on respect for one’s own right to life. Someone who defends his life is not guilty of murder even if he is forced to deal his aggressor a lethal blow:

    If a man in self-defense uses more than necessary violence, it will be unlawful: whereas if he repels force with moderation, his defense will be lawful. . . . Nor is it necessary for salvation that a man omit the act of moderate self-defense to avoid killing the other man, since one is bound to take more care of one’s own life than of another’s.66

    2265 Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for one who is responsible for the lives of others. The defense of the common good requires that an unjust aggressor be rendered unable to cause harm. For this reason, those who legitimately hold authority also have the right to use arms to repel aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their responsibility.

  7. Uxixu says:

    Need to read your St Augustine, Elizabeth, as well as the Catechism as Scott W posted. We can indeed trust in Our Lord but we also not only have the right but duty to defend ourselves and those who can’t. That sign only stops those who will obey and it leaves them defenseless.

  8. New Sister says:

    @ Elizabeth D: thank God this “church” didn’t up such signs:

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/12/10/colorado.shootings/

  9. wmeyer says:

    Well done, Scott. Whenever I encounter people who are clearly confused about things within our control, and those which are not, I refer to the Catechism. I find I routinely cite #2241 (immigration), #2271-73 (abortion), and the three you cited.

    In summary, the CCC is our guide to living a moral and Catholic life. When what I hear (whether from cleric or layperson) is at odds with what is in the CCC, the latter must always win.

  10. Lepidus says:

    Luke 22:36 – “…and he that hath not, let him sell his coat and buy a Glock”….

    (I’m going from memory, so I might have a word wrong there).

  11. Elizabeth D says:

    It is unimaginable what just war theory would have to do with coming armed to a typical US Catholic parish. If this was Syria, then quite possibly there’s a case for appointing someone or two or more someones to be security guard at Mass. But it’s not.

    A holy old priest I knew who was twice a hostage in the horrific civil war in Sierra Leone, was at the end of his captivity permitted to say Mass. Even the rebel soldiers would attend sometimes, though not all were even Christian. He would preach against their violence… they listened in silence. They would come armed and his one requirement was they needed to leave the guns at the door. They did. In the midst of chaos and evil, the church was a refuge for laying down arms, a place for a bit of trust, a refuge of peace. I suggest it should have that meaning.

  12. Rancid says:

    My recollection from reading Fr. Victor’s book was that he seemed to feel that many of the rebel soldiers were decent people (there were some who were wicked of course). If the soldiers who came to his Mass left their guns at the door then it shows that they weren’t ill-willed. The simple fact is that the ONLY people who obey the gun-free zones are the ones who aren’t criminals. Criminals not only ignore the gun-free zones but see them as easy targets since they know that they won’t have anything to worry about from the occupants.

    I just saw a neat app called “Gun Free Zone”. Looks like it’s available for Apple or Android. Requires crowd sourced data so most places don’t have any designation yet but if we all start using it that will change.

  13. Sid Cundiff in NC says:

    a .50 Caliber small frame revolver! I can only image the the recoil! Did you shoot it? and if so, Father, did you need to see an orthopedic dr. afterward? [ka-BLAM! The recoil was significant, but it didn’t hurt.]

  14. incredulous says:

    Elizabeth,
    You didn’t get the parody in the “gun free zone” video. The fact that schools are gun free doesn’t stop some psychopath from slaughtering innocent children.

    Capetown South Africa is considered one of the more civilized cities on the planet. Yet…
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_James_Church_massacre

    Milwaukee is considered civilized, yet… http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/03/12/wisconsin.shootings/index.html

    Although not Christian, again Milwaukee… http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/2012/August/Police-7-Dead-in-Wisconsin-Sikh-Temple-Shooting/

    Don’t you get it? Psychos where they know they won’t meet resistance.

  15. george says:

    ElizabethD, CCC 2263-2265 are not about just-war theory. It is also not true that “firearms == violence”. Whenever I take my family out and about, I am armed. I am responsible for all 10 of us, not just me. Thanks be to God, I’ve never needed my firearm and I pray I never will. But if it is God’s permissive will that a danger should approach us, I am responsible to care for us as best I can.

    I do trust in our Lord for my safety. I also trust in Him to meet our needs for food and housing — but that doesn’t mean I’ll quit my job and just “trust” that the food will be available. Likewise, I will not go about without a means of defense.

  16. Phil_NL says:

    Elizabeth D. geoffrey:

    We trust in the Lord to get into Heaven. We trust in Glock/Smith&Wesson/Sig Sauer/Colt etc. not to get into Heaven too soon. (assuming our spiritual affairs are in order; many a criminal cuts short the time for that…). Bottom line: We have a job to do here on Earth, a life that has value. There is nothing wrong in trying to protect that life, both your own and that of others.

    And there are few things as effective in doing so than a gun.

  17. The Masked Chicken says:

    “And there are few things as effective in doing so than a gun.”

    A force shield?

    Seriously, where are the flying cars and force fields? Lasers are both silent and deadly. Guns are, so, Twentieth-century.

    The Chicken

  18. The Masked Chicken says: Seriously, where are the flying cars and force fields?

    Darn it! I want my jet pack! They promised us jet packs!

  19. Phil_NL says:

    Dear Chicken,

    Just wait for self-targeting ammo. If it’s possible for missiles, it’s possible for bullets, just a bit harder. And then you don’t even need a line-of-sight, as with a laser.

    The 22nd century is closer than you think ;)

  20. wmeyer says:

    They promised us jet packs!

    Were those part of Obamacare? Perhaps the sign-up website isn’t completed yet. I’m sure they will need to be registered. ;)

  21. PA mom says:

    Elizabeth-there are some persons whose occupations are such that they remain in constant danger and wear their weapons at all times outside of their homes.
    Surely, you do not wish these brave persons to be denied Mass due to the risk such a policy could bring upon themselves and those around them.

  22. Funny how liberals think a “gun free zone” sign will deter the bad guys! If anything such a sign would probably only affect the law abiding citizens who want to try to respect the wishes of the business posting the sign. It’d be interesting to know how many folks with CCLs ignore such signs.

  23. wmeyer says:

    Funny how liberals think a “gun free zone” sign will deter the bad guys!

    I think most people will recognize these signs as declaring “victim here, ripe for plucking”.

  24. Bea says:

    “Gun free zone” signs are redundant.
    The only ones that would obey the “gun free zone” are honest people who don’t carry guns, anyway.
    Great to the point video.
    Thanks Fr. Z.

    I asked my husband (who was in law-enforcement and had to often “qualify”) if he wanted to see your target results.
    He thought he was going to look at a bishop’s outline. HAH-HAH.
    Anyway he had great praise for your shooting abilities.
    “Even those not in the “black” would bring a man down”, he said.

    “Hit the black, see the red” [Nicely done.]
    Otherwise you and others will soon be dead.

    St. Peter had a sword with him in the Garden of Gethsemane, though this was not the time to use it and He (Our Lord) healed the temple guard from his severed ear.
    Our Lord didn’t tell soldiers to lay down their arms, only to “be content with your pay”
    Guns are not the culprits of deadly crimes.
    Why banish guns?
    Banish the evil men who pull the triggers.

  25. The Masked Chicken says:

    “Elizabeth-there are some persons whose occupations are such that they remain in constant danger and wear their weapons at all times outside of their homes.
    Surely, you do not wish these brave persons to be denied Mass due to the risk such a policy could bring upon themselves and those around them.”

    I really hesitate to mention this, but, the idea of bringing guns to church calls to mind that, probably, in one of my darker moments, I recently started writing a computer game called, Novus Ordo, in which there is, literally, no separation of church and state: the church is the state and the state is the church. The game allows you to play from ten different perspectives: male or female, 1-20 yrs., 20-30 yrs., 30-40 yrs., 40-60 yrs., and 60+ yrs. The same story unfolds from each viewpoint and each decision changes the course if events (of course, playing as a 5 yr. old girl is really interesting). In the story, men-in-black carrying guns (not priests, but church police) circulate around the mandatory church services looking for people who are not, “actively participating.” You are one family among the secret freedom fighters. The story opens with men-in-black approaching your pew during a Sunday service. The story starting from the viewpoint of the 60+ year old woman is hilarious (those poor MIB).

    It occurred to me that this might be the unspoken nightmare occurring in some alternate universe in the future where Vatican II was really, horribly, realized. In our universe, nothing like this will happen, at least directly from Vatican II, but, sometimes, one is allowed to consider worst-cases.

    The reason I haven’t finished it is because occurred to me after spend a whole day working on it that it might be in violation of canon 212 no. 3, because it might be seen as being a parody of the modern post-Vatican II mess in the Church. It is a cool story, with a thought provoking title, however. What would you do if something like the national church in China came to a city near you, except that the expectations were, “a little more severe?”

    Still, if an argument can be made that it does not violate Can. 212 no. 3, I will certainly finish it (it can be played in a browser) and post it to a Catholic games website (not that any exists, but a few of us are working on that).

    The Chicken

  26. Clinton says:

    I think Christ’s words in Luke 22: 36 make his views on self defense fairly clear…

    “… Then He said to them, “But now, let him who has a purse take it, and likewise a wallet;
    and let him who has no sword sell his tunic and buy one.”

  27. The Masked Chicken says:

    “Just wait for self-targeting ammo.”

    The ammo targets itself? Kinda ineffective :)

    The Chicken

  28. Ryan says:

    I love how that “swords into plowshares” bit is constantly cited as though the whole world is now peaceful. Or perhaps that we’re to be martyrs to this kind of pointless violence. Absurd! In Christ alone has the universe been reconciled and all creation groans in anticipation of His return. Until then…
    –When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, did you want anything? But they said: Nothing. Then said he unto them: But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise a scrip; and he that hath not, let him sell his coat, and buy a sword. For I say to you, that this that is written must yet be fulfilled in me: And with the wicked was he reckoned. For the things concerning me have an end. But they said: Lord, behold here are two swords. And he said to them, It is enough. And going out, he went, according to his custom, to the mount of Olives. And his disciples also followed him. (Luke 22:35-39)

    1. Establish kingdom
    2. Defend Kingdom
    3. Wait and pray.

  29. Uxixu says:

    Elizabeth, it’s about the principle that your life is a precious gift from God and your right to defend it as well as a duty to defned those can’t defend themselves. The choice of martyrdom is available to us all but to choose that for others against their will is abominable.

    That said, I am sort of ok with the concept of the “Victim Disarmament Zone” as long as it is clearly marked, I can choose to enter it or not at my free will, and someone has the responsibility to provide for my defense. In court, there are armed bailiffs, etc.

  30. Phil_NL says:

    “Hit the black, see the red”
    Otherwise you and others will soon be dead.

    Best quote in ages! Father, may I nominate this for a gold star?

    Chicken: I mean that the ammo finds the target by itself :p

  31. MattnSue says:

    Any surprise that, when you got to 30′, you were off… to the right? [Yes, a little. By the way, those three circled are from the other guy who shot one-handed-lefty (his right arm was in a sling). But, yes. I usually start to drop down to the left. I was compensating a little, but, yes.]

  32. Geoffrey says:

    I really have no strong views one way or the other when it comes to America’s gun debate. What I am mostly uncomfortable with is the American gun culture, which seems to see the country as though it were still the wild west (a town with one sheriff and lots of bandits, thereby every man for himself). [?!?] I do believe that weapons of any kind do not belong in a church (unless we are talking about St Peter’s Basilica and the person of His Holiness the Pope).

    I think the Swiss way is ideal:
    http://www.tfp.org/tfp-home/news-commentary/in-switzerland-a-christian-sense-of-family-and-country-prevents-deaths-with-firearms.html

    Unfortunately, the USA is no Switzerland! [Gosh, what a shame.]

  33. Uxixu says:

    Unfortunately, Geoffrey, the Supreme Court has ruled exactly that. In Castle Rock v Gonzales, DeShaney v Winnebago County amongst others, they ruled that government is not obligated to defend individual citizens or enforce restraining orders. Sure most times someone will come but the US has huge geographic disparity that make it very much unlike Europe, for example. Even in an urban area, police response is measured in minutes when most confrontations are over in seconds.

    In a crisis situation like a national disaster or riot situation every man is literally on his own (LAPD was specifically ordered to stay out from the riot area during the Rodney King area) and many don’t realize that and are completely unprepared. Witness people turning into savages after just a week in Katrina. And unfortunately, also dear to my heart, California Highway Patrol were over there illegally confiscating weaponry, despite the laws against that. And yes, the wild west and our culture in general promotes self reliance and a healthy skepticism of government and creeping tyranny.

  34. Uxixu says: police response is measured in minutes

    Right.

    When something happens, make three calls.

    1. Call your lawyer.
    2. Call 911.
    3. Call and order a pizza.

    Guess who will get there first?

  35. Uxixu says:

    zing!

    Note that it’s almost an hour in Detroit. :o

    http://money.msn.com/now/post–a-911-response-in-detroit-takes-how-long

  36. Uxixu says: Note that it’s almost an hour in Detroit.

    I am sure you know the classic response to the question, “Why do you carry a gun?”

  37. Uxixu says:

    “Why do you carry a gun?”

    “Because I can’t throw a rock at 1200 feet a second?”

  38. Elizabeth D says: It is unimaginable what just war theory would have to do with coming armed to a typical US Catholic parish. If this was Syria, then quite possibly there’s a case for appointing someone or two or more someones to be security guard at Mass. But it’s not.

    Talk to the man in a typical U.S. Catholic parish in Ogden, Utah whose son-in-law came in and shot him in the back of the head during Mass. Miraculously, he not only lived but made a speedy recovery. Ask the pastor of that parish what he thinks about guns in church. You would not like his answer.

    Come to think of it, that is not a typical U.S. parish as it has reverent liturgy and a regular TLM. But my point stands.

  39. Uxixu says:

    Oh I remember!

    “I carry a gun because a cop is too heavy.”

  40. Elizabeth D says:

    Uxixu wrote: “Elizabeth, it’s about the principle that your life is a precious gift from God and your right to defend it as well as a duty to defned those can’t defend themselves.”

    Why are you imagining my life and others’ are in danger in church? Why make churches a place of armament and anxiety?

  41. Elizabeth D says:

    It is RARE that there is some kind of violence in a church. Every once in a while one hears about some incident in the news. One hears about shark attacks. They are RARE. It is not a reason to carry a weapon whenever you are swimming at the beach. [And then… it happens to you. Elsewhere, someone says, “Oh, that’s nothing to worry about. It’s rare.”]

  42. Uxixu says:

    Elizabeth, why do you conflate bearing arms with anxiety?

    Q: “Why are you nervous enough to carry a gun?”
    A: “I’m not nervous BECAUSE I carry the gun.”

    More seriously, I don’t want to use my weapon any more than I want to use the airbags in my car or the fire extinguisher in my kitchen. On a practical level it’s a piece of personal safety equipment. What’s the old saying? “Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.”

    On the theoretical level, if you’re perfectly comfortable trusting others to your defense and/or mercy in the rare instance you might them, that’s certainly your prerogative. I definitely believe the blind (to address a point from someone else) have as much a right to self defense as you or I do and none of us is OBLIGATED to pacifism. I also believe in a republic of free citizens and not in a special caste of military/law enforcement that alone has the right and responsibility of bearing arms and protecting the ordinary people. There’s a word for that, btw: aristocracy.

    That said, with rights come responsibilities. In this case, proper safety and handling and training and judgment.

  43. AnAmericanMother says:

    Elizabeth,

    Fires in the home are relatively rare, most of us don’t have car accidents frequently — but we still have fire and auto insurance, and fire extinguishers and airbags and seatbelts. And as others have noted, we have responsibility for our own safety and that of our families. Even if you are not willing to defend yourself against criminal violence, you should be willing to defend a small child, whether your own or a neighbor’s.
    It’s important to stop thinking of a firearm as some sort of autonomous entity with supernatural powers. That way lies irrational fear of an inanimate object. It’s not really your fault, because the news media and the public schools are saturated with propaganda.
    In reality, a firearm is just another tool useful in an emergency. Like many tools (power saws or gasoline or electricity) it can be dangerous if misused, so it’s important to be trained.
    What I would suggest is that you take advantage of one of the many firearms training programs available almost anywhere. The NRA has several excellent courses specifically designed for ladies, which include not only practical instruction but education on the applicable laws and moral principles as well as situation avoidance and alertness. Even if you never own a firearm, that knowledge will give you factual information and confidence — and make you less susceptible to fear-mongering by the usual suspects.

  44. Elizabeth, church violence could be even more rare if parishioners came in armed. Even lunatic spree killers know better than to target places where people are likely to be armed.

    By the way, notice that violence against Christians, even in their own churches, has escalated around the world, and vandalism against Catholic churches in this country is on the rise. The government itself is at open war with the Catholic Church in the United States. It’s a short step from where we are now to physical persecution. We’re not as safe as all that.

  45. Maltese says:

    Christ’s disciples were armed–those were dangerous times, as are ours.

    I’m not saying we should all carry 50 cals to mass, but maybe a Glock 27!

  46. ghp95134 says:

    Uxixu says: “Why do you carry a gun?””
    “Because I can’t throw a rock at 1200 feet a second?”

    Give the man a GOLD STAR !!!! I like that response better than “Cuz I can’t carry a cop.”

    Father —
    When are you going to take some photos of you wearing a cassock and biretta while at the range? I’d love seeing you in biretta shooting a Beretta. (Rather see you shooting a 1911A1.)
    Anything! [1911? I don’t have one. Should I start a special 1911 Fund? I was recently looking at a Springfield Range Officer.]

    Muzzle flash – spent cartridge in mid air — you in cassock & biretta ….. Priceless!

    –Guy

  47. Bea says:

    For the record:
    Joel (before judgement/nowadays while we are still at war)
    Isaiah (at and after judgement,when peace shall reign/a time not yet here)

    Sorry, Elizabeth, but it’s in the Book (the Bible, that is)

    Joel 3:9-10
    9 Proclaim ye this among the nations: Prepare war, raise up the strong: let them come, let all the men of war come up. 10 Cut your ploughshares into swords, and your spades into spears. Let the weak say: I am strong.

    Isaiah 2:4
    Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
    4 And he shall judge the Gentiles, and rebuke many people: and they shall turn their swords into ploughshares, and their spears into sickles: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they be exercised any more to war.

  48. Elizium23 says:

    Father, with all due respect. It’s a Compact Disc (optical). Contrast with hard disk drive (magnetic), or floppy disk. Compare with DVD: Digital Versatile Disc.

  49. JonPatrick says:

    I love the Advent at Ephesus CD. I got it last year but too late to play it much before Christmas came. This year we listen to it a lot in the car. I have decided that this is the closest I will get in my earthly life to how Heaven sounds.

  50. The Masked Chicken says:

    “Fires in the home are relatively rare, most of us don’t have car accidents frequently — but we still have fire and auto insurance, and fire extinguishers and airbags and seatbelts.”

    Mugging insurance??

    The Chicken

  51. Imrahil says:

    Dear @Chicken, I don’t think you need to worry about can. 213 § 3.

    – upholding in an undamaged way Faith: seems to be no problem
    – and morals: dito
    – and reverence towards the shepherds: if anywhere, here could the problem be, but I rather don’t think there is*
    – and respecting common utility: no problem (it would be great fun and in service of a good cause)
    – and dignity of persons: no problem at all, as you probably won’t mention anyone personally.

    *You are not, I assume, calling them names, or encourage people to disrespect, but you are merely taking their policy in a satirical way, for fun and as a teaching moment, to a possible logical conclusion. That should be within a Catholic’s rights.

    Sounds interesting, at any rate.

  52. Imrahil says:

    (can 212, not 213)

  53. ghp95134 says:

    Father Z sez: [1911? I don’t have one. Should I start a special 1911 Fund? I was recently looking at a Springfield Range Officer.]

    It has a very good review: http://www.gunsandammo.com/reviews/springfield-range-officer-review/

    Need photos of you at the range in cassock!!

    –Guy

    [In the cassock. Well. We’ll see. And the biretta I have won’t work well with my “ears”. I would need some of those in ear, buds, for that. And, yes, that Range Officer is pretty spiffy.]

  54. Sid Cundiff in NC says:

    Reverend Father,

    In reply to your fisk of my post at 10 December 2013 at 12:17 pm, my gun guru cousin wrote me about that .50 Caliber gun: “I shot one some years ago. Recoil no worse than a full house 44 magnum, which is considerable! They are built on S&Ws “N” frame, their largest, and they are 5 shots instead of 6.”

    I’m glad you found the recoil bearable. Have you ever shot at .44 Magnum? [Oh yes! But it has been a long time.]

    Regards from North Carolina.

  55. Sid Cundiff in NC says:

    In reply to incredulous at 10 December 2013 at 12:19 pm, who wrote “Don’t you get it? Psychos where they know they won’t meet resistance.

    True enough, and they don’t have to be Psychos. My gun trainer told me that there’s a fellow out there who likes to hurt people — it’s fun for him –, BUT he doesn’t like to be hurt. A firearm lets him know that he will be hurt, if he decides to mess with you.

  56. Sid Cundiff in NC says:

    Elizabeth D. @ 10 December 2013 at 6:29 pm:

    Disruption happens at Mass, and sometimes even violence. The pastor of every church needs a plan in anticipation of this, and he needs to make that plan known to the parochial vicar and the ushers.

  57. Sid: Yes. You are surely right about that. Just as a father of a family needs a plan for his wife and kids in case something happens in or to their house, so too the parish priest needs contingency plans.