Stop the whining LCWR. You aren’t the only group getting an extreme make-over.

Long-time lax catholics may not enjoy the resection and sutures the physicians of the CDF and the USCCB are applying to certain groups within Holy Church, but, as St. Augustine once preached, a doctor doesn’t stop cutting just because the patient screams for him to stop (cf. s. 80, 3).

The leadership of the Leadership Conference of Women Religious (LCWR – a subsidiary of the Magisterium of Nuns), together with their feminist Greek chorus, has been whining about the reform efforts launched by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.  The LCWR has been caught out, and called to account, and they don’t like it one little bit.  Thus, they moan and gripe and play the martyr because they have been “investigated” and tasked to change their ways.  Boo hoo.

They are not the only one’s who have been investigated.

We see the same thing going on in Ireland, for example.  Take the case of the Irish Redemptorist priest whose odd columns and media commentary earned him correction from the CDF.  His defenders are whining … in much the manner as the LCWR, as a matter of fact.

The Church in Ireland needs a pretty severe overhaul, as the recent apostolic visitation has revealed.  They aren’t going to like it one little bit.  One of the key elements to a renewal of anything Irish is going to be a reformation of the seminaries.   To that end….

From CNA:

Irish College in Rome changes staff after apostolic visitation

Rome, Italy, May 10, 2012 / 11:37 am (CNA/EWTN News).- Three of the four senior staff members at the Pontifical Irish College in Rome are stepping down from their posts after a Vatican investigation concluded Ireland’s seminaries are not doing enough to promote Catholic orthodoxy. [Keep in mind that this was one of the concerns of the CDF in examining the LCWR, which in turn influences the spiritual and intellectual formation of the women religious under its umbrella.  The CDF wasn’t concerned only with the errors the LCWR was committing, but also with the good things they were omitting.]

“In colleges there is a constant changeover, maybe after the Apostolic Visitation it is not a bad idea to bring in new people, new ideas and move forward,” Archbishop Diarmuid Martin of Dublin told CNA on May 10 in Rome.

Today’s announcement comes in the wake of the March 2012 publication of a two-year investigation – officially called an apostolic visitation — into the health of the Irish Church. The visitation of Irish seminaries was led by Cardinal Timothy Dolan of New York.  [There’s that name again.  Follow him on Twitter.]

While the report praised Irish seminary staff for being “dedicated formators” who were “committed to the work of priestly training,” [This is Vaticanese.  The Holy See’s medicinal letters always start with praising this and that and the other thing, and then – THWACK – just like the ruler of an LCWR nun when she was young and teaching 2nd grade.] it also called for a “greater concern for the intellectual formation of seminarians” to ensure that their education was “in full conformity with the Church’s Magisterium.”

The report also recommended that the pastoral training of seminarians be re-evaluated to ensure “it is sacramental, priestly and apostolic” and concerned with “preparing candidates to celebrate the sacraments and to preach.”

Overall, the visitation found that the renewal of the Catholic Church in Ireland was being hampered by “a certain tendency, not dominant but nevertheless fairly widespread among priests, religious and laity, to hold theological opinions at variance with the teachings of the Magisterium.” [I love it” “a certain tendency”… “not widespread”.  That means “it’s a real problem and its everywhere”.]


About Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

Fr. Z is the guy who runs this blog. o{]:¬)
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  1. Augustin57 says:

    I LOVE the subtleties of the Vatican! Unfortunately, it is lost on most in this modernistic, loud, abrasive society. But you have to give them this: they are smoooth! :)

  2. wmeyer says:

    I need to learn from their delicate presentation. I do pray, however, that the message is not overlooked in the gentle prose.

  3. frjim4321 says:

    Well, this might be a bit premature because we don’t have the official response of the LCWR which may not be forthcoming for a few weeks. I would expect them to proceed with greater transparency and decorum than that with which they have been treated. [Piffle. The CDF, in studying the issues brought to their attention is under no obligation to carry out their mandate with “transparency”, which can be deeply harmful to people who enjoy the right to a good reputation.]

    I believe the presidency is currently gathering input from the represented communities (the vast majority of U.S. women religious) and will be formulating a response by July. [So, you are an insider.]

  4. asperges says:

    Sir Humphrey (of “Yes Minister”) would have made a wonderful Cardinal.

  5. frjim4321 says:


    No, that’s been published somewhere.

    Though we have connections to some large communities hereabouts.

  6. robtbrown says:

    Frjim4321 says:
    11 May 2012 at 10:10 am


    No, that’s been published somewhere.

    Though we have connections to some large, dying communities hereabouts.


  7. Supertradmum says:

    Having been in Ireland recently for three months, I can assure you that the country is no longer Catholic in culture, and some of the priests are heretics. The weakness of the Church has created a hole for religion. The growth of socialism and communism,wicca, new age nutsyness, the laxity of the laity towards evil, the acceptance of fornication, adultery, homosexuality, contraception, etc. are all very obvious to any serious Catholic. The real Catholics are the minority, as are the holy priests. Good that the Vatican is finally taking the much needed steps…Ireland is a mess.

  8. rcg says:

    I think this is related, so bear with me a bit. I am becoming more comfortable, through confession, with the idea of Purgatory because I want to be really ready and proper when I finally go before the Lord. Think preparation and prayers at the foot of the altar. I would not like it at first, but if I was found to be truly at variance, pretty badly so, with the Church, I might welcome excommunication as long as it was followed by a strong catechesis to straighten me out. I like competitive sports and if I am messing up, the first thing I need to do is get technique evaluated and straightened out. I may not like it, but like losing less. So maybe what they need is a sort of temporal purgatory and tune-up. I wonder if this is a possibility for these communities? They have been ‘catechized’ by secular psychology, politics, etc. over the last several years. If they really want to be fit before God, if they really love the Church, Her priests and bishops, maybe they will see this as something helpful. Just a thought.

  9. frjim4321 says:

    Though we have connections to some large, dying communities hereabouts. – RobtBrown

    Thanks for providing me with new insight into your personality.

  10. frjim4321 says:


    (I was going to say “character” but that might be a bit optimistic.)

  11. AnnAsher says:

    I am very pleased they are pursuing the issues with LCWR. The US Bishops are also now investigating the Girl Scouts. Ahem, while I do not believe they are a healthy club for my girls spiritually or morally and practically they are a goofy waste of time, IMO. Seriously? How about we fight the big battles? The sex scandal, the HHS scandal, liturgical scandals. Then we can talk about GSA.

  12. Well I just hope the damage isn’t that critical to the order. I’ve been ok so far with the Redemptorists I’ve been in contact with in my area and in fact after a retreat I loved their founding charism and reasons for existing in the 1st place under St. Alphonsus Liguori. Sidenote: Want to get in some form all of his major works (16 volumes worth!) I got only an old copy of Glories of Mary on paperback right now.

  13. AnAmericanMother says:

    Unfortunately, if parishes are sponsoring Girl Scout troops something has to be done.
    If GSA is promoting anti-Catholic viewpoints (and they are) then they have to shape up or lose their parish sponsorship. And how our girls are being taught is important – they are the next generation of Catholic wives and mothers.
    The head of GSA recently spoke in support of Planned Parenthood (although they are now walking that back, saying she wasn’t speaking for the organization. Really?) The published materials my daughter got when she was a Junior Scout promoted early sex, sexual experimentation (including homosexuality), abortion, and political viewpoints that were none of the GSA’s business (but were all far left).
    We got her out of the Girl Scouts and into the BSA Venturers program the day she turned 14. What a contrast! Not only are they ‘morally straight’ and ‘reverent’, they do much cooler stuff. On top of being amoral, GSA is for wussies.

  14. frjim4321 says:

    I had not heard that the Girl Scouts are under investigation.

    There are neither GSA or BSA troops here, which is probably a good thing because I would not relish being expected to be a henchman for ejecting either group. It would seem to me if one has to go, they both would have to go.

    BSA is pretty well known for discriminating against gay youth, at least from what I have read. I believe gay youth have been told they needn’t apply.

    I would not want to be the pastor who kick out the GSA and kicks out the BSA. That would be quite the sticky wicket.

  15. frjim4321 says:

    Too fast on the trigger. What I meant was “I would not want to be the pastor who kicks out the GSA and allows the BSA to remain.”

  16. AnAmericanMother says:

    “I would not want to be the pastor who kicks out the GSA and allows the BSA to remain.”

    Why not? They are different organizations with different philosophies. Unless you can’t see a difference between promoting abortion and sexual ‘experimentation’, including lesbianism, in underage girls — and making a decision to keep homosexual activity away from underage boys?

    Believe me, the parents can tell the difference.

  17. frjim4321 says:

    I apologize in advance if this is double posted. I tried to post from my PDA from dinner earlier but I don’t see it here.

    AAM, I hear what you are saying, but I have been in scouting since Bobcat when my dear Father was cubmaster. I have been through cubscouts, weblows, boyscouts, OA, explorers, Catholic Scouting, scout holy hours, scout retreats. I have been troop chaplain for 12 years. Anyone who thinks BSA is purely hetero needs to remove their head from YKW.

    Frankly scouting was a safe refuge for the boys who were not hetero and not interested in bloodsport. Then scout leadership kneejerked from their abuse crisis and ejected the kids some of whom needed scouting the most.

    AAM, I’m telling you, if I was ever told that I had to eject GSA from my parish, I would announce that in the interest of fairness, we have to let the BSA go also. I can’t imagine that the BSA have done less harm to youth. And this is from a proud scouter from the age of 8 to the age of 37.

  18. AnAmericanMother says:

    Our families have been in scouting for very a long time – my dad was at the 1939 Jamboree, and my DH’s grandfather founded the first troop in Arizona Territory as it then was.

    Never thought of Scouting as a “refuge” – more of an adventure and leadership opportunity for boys to learn self-reliance and outdoor skills. Of course our troop is pretty hard core – about a third to half our boys make Eagle – and for that matter the Venture Crew is too. Philmont, Northern Boundary, annual conventions, etc.

    I don’t waste my time trying to exercise my “gaydar” on the kids. . . and neither does anyone else here. All are welcome except the ones that have been indoctrinated to the extent that they are already proclaiming sexual proclivities. That is a destructive influence on the younger ones, and can be even more dangerous from a molestation point of view than an adult. And the parents would not be at all amused.

    You don’t do kids any favors by “affirming” them at an early age in ANY sexual conduct. That’s the really creepy thing about the homosexualist movement. It also prevents people from assessing the relative potential for harm between organizations that promote early sexualization of children, and those that discourage it.

  19. pinoytraddie says:

    That Suspended Priest is Passionist,NOT Redemptorist. [Whatever.]

  20. robtbrown says:

    frjim4321 says:

    Though we have connections to some large, dying communities hereabouts. – RobtBrown

    Thanks for providing me with new insight into your personality.

    I assume you’re referring to opinions based on experience, reason, and faith–rather than ideology (which seems to be your MO).

    It is a known fact that most women’s orders in the US are on the decline. That’s why there are constant appeals for contributions to support the retired sisters. There is a large mother house near me. The once crowded novitiate is now little else than a nursing home. A visit to the cemetery tells the story of how many sisters died in the past few years–sad, compared to the few who have entered.

    The decline of orders of sisters is mostly why tuition in Catholic schools is unaffordable for so many middle class families.

    There are some exceptions, such as the Dominican Sisters of Nashville and the Dominican Sisters of Mary Mother of The Eucharist (started by Nashville Mother Assumpta Long op), both of which are flourishing. The contemplative Carmelite House in Lincoln filled very quickly and needs to make a foundation (St Teresa’s rule mandates a limit in house size).

    If you know of others that are doing well, feel free to mention them, O Enlightened One.

    BTW, I did some research a few years ago, and the two US men’s orders that were on the steepest decline were the Jesuits and the Christian Brothers. The SJ numbers went from about 500 novices and 4000 scholastics in 1964 to about 10% of that in 1989. SJ’s I knew in Rome were not optimistic that those numbers would improve. The number of Christian Brothers in the US was shrinking.

    For that matter, most US dioceses are not ordaining priests at replacement lever. The FSSP, however, is flourishing–also Clear Creek Abbey.

  21. robtbrown says:

    The French were ahead of the curve on the Scouts. Forty years ago there were les Scouts de France and les Scouts d’Europe The former was secular. The latter was Catholic and would visit Fontgombault in small groups, camping on the grounds and attending mass and (sometimes) Office.

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