“Catholic Democrats” … “Sycophantic Toadies”… take your pick

Just how deeply sycophantic are the political toadies of the group Catholic Democrats?

They are worked up about the interchange between Bp. Tobin of Providence and pro-abortion Rep. Patrick Kennedy (D-RI).  The group Catholic Democrats want abortion as part of health care and therefore they can’t stand Catholic bishops who speak out when "Catholics" support abortion.

The tactic of Catholic Deomcrats is to turn this into a political issue.  For example, if the Republican Party has a pro-life (anti-abortion) plank, and if a Catholic bishop speaks out when a pro-abortion Democrat supports abortion rights… therefore… try to follow now… therefore the Bishop is actually supporting the Republican Party.  See?  See?  Wasn’t that easy?  Great reasoning.

Catholic Democrats are political hacks.  They might be Democrats, but they sure aren’t Catholics.

From the Catholic Democrats website:

November 24, 2009

Support Congressman Kennedy and Health Care Reform

Call Bishop Tobin Today

I believe in an America that is officially neither Catholic, Protestant nor Jewish–where no public official either requests or accepts instructions on public policy from the Pope, the National Council of Churches or any other ecclesiastical source–where no religious body seeks to impose its will directly or indirectly upon the general populace or the public acts of its officials–and where religious liberty is so indivisible that an act against one church is treated as an act against all.
– President John F. Kennedy, September 12, 1960, Houston Texas, The Greater Houston Ministerial Association

[What a misguided and damaging speech that was.   What comes to mind is the phrase: "But for Wales?"]
Dear Friends,

This past Sunday, it was reported that Rhode Island Bishop Thomas Tobin had barred his Congressional representative, Patrick Kennedy (D-RI), from receiving Holy Communion in the diocese in early 2007, a sanction that remains in place today[This is mendacious.  Bp. Tobin has not imposed any sanction or censure on Rep. Kennedy – though he probably should.  He requested in private discussion that the Congressman not receive.  That is not the same as a "sanction".   The Bishop did not "bar" him.  But that is not to the purposes of this group, who will lie for the sake of their message.]  We are asking you for your help in responding to this action and to the bishop’s  disparagement of Representative Kennedy’s Catholic faith [I believe that Rep. Kennedy disparaged his own Catholic faith by his actions and public statements.] that occurred in the course of a public dispute that preceded this recent revelation.

[Watch this.  You can see how Catholic Democrats try to drag this who thing over into the sphere of mere politics.] Bishop Tobin has made no secret of his preference for the Republican positions on a variety of social issues.  A majority of Catholics hold views similar to Congressman Kennedy, [And this is another problem: They think morality can be determined by majorities.] namely that constructive measures to decrease the number of abortions [No… I think Catholic Democrats actually want abortion to be paid for by tax-payer dollars.] are a more Christian and effective approach than the vague criminalization threats of the past. [This issue of "criminalization" must be discussed at length elsewhere.  For now, they are just using it as a scare tactic.] Catholic Democrats believes that Bishop Tobin’s [wait for it…] personal political views are driving actions that are not only hurtful to Catholics in Rhode Island but also to the larger Church [ ROFL!  Sure!  I bet they do!  The last thing they want is strong bishops.] – as well as fueling the political divisions across our country. 

This public conflict is deeply regrettable, particularly at a time when our country is debating national health care reform. [And Catholic Democrats want abortion to be paid for.]  In the midst of this historic opportunity, that would help millions of people in need, Bishop Tobin returned to a divisive path.  Building on his sanction [Again, it was not a sanction.  It was a request.] in 2007, the bishop recently issued a public letter that only added to the polarization of the health care debate when faith, reason, and civility [What in his letter was a violation of "faith, reason, and civility"?  Quotes, please?] are called for, particularly from our pastoral leaders.  [But remember: If the Bishop takes a position, then he is not being "pastoral".  "Pastoral" is where you let liberals do what they want.]

His open letter to Rep. Kennedy states, "For the moment I’d like to set aside the discussion of health care reform, as important and relevant as it is, …." [That’s because the bishop’s real purpose has more to do with something else, and not the specific issue of health care reform.  They actually do understand this.  They are just weaving a lie.] Catholic Democrats believes that it is time to get back to that discussion and make the passage of health care reform a priority for all Catholics – including Bishop Tobin – building on the common ground [There’s a buzz word for ya!] we share of helping those most in need.

However, we believe that it is important to support any Catholic Democratic public servant who is being denied Communion for unjust political reasons. [Remember: this is not political.  Also, they are really talking about supporting pro-abortion Democrats because they are pro-abortion.]  We also believe that it is important to urge Bishop Tobin to put his pastoral responsibilities ahead of his political views [Again, Bp. Tobin didn’t do this for political reasons.] and to focus on helping pass health care reform legislation.

[Pay attention here.  We could do these things…] We are asking you to do a few things:

    * Contact Representative Kennedy’s office, voice your support for him as a Catholic, and ask him to continue working for affordable, universal health care for all.  [So long as he abandons his support for abortion, etc.] Call 202-225-4911 or send an email to him by clicking here.
    * Contact Bishop Tobin and politely ask him to stop using the Eucharist as a political weapon, [Thank him for being strong and defending our Catholic identity in the public square.] and to direct his pastoral energies toward helping pass affordable, universal health care for all.  Call 401-278-4500 or send an email to the bishop, care of the Communications Office at kdavis@dioceseofprovidence.org.
    * Consider writing a letter to the editor – usually 250 words – for your local or a national newspaper. [Watch this…] If you are interested in doing so, please contact us at media@catholicdemocrats.org and we will assist you in developing your key message points and the best media outlets[They will effectively write your letter for you!]

Please forward this email to Catholics you know.  Forward to a Friend

Your support and help will make a difference across the nation today, and in the future.  Thank you and Thanksgiving blessings to you and your family.

Warm regards,

Patrick Whelan, MD PhD
Suzanne Morse
Lisa Schare
Steve Krueger

PS  Please consider making a donation to Catholic Democrats to help us continue our efforts for health care reform, and advancing Catholic Social Teaching in the public square and within the Democratic Party.

[Here are their talking points.]

Background On Communion as a Political Weapon and
the Public Dispute Between Bishop Tobin and Representative Kennedy

Since 2004, a small but vocal minority of bishops – whose  political views are closely aligned with the Republican Party [!] – have called for denying Communion to Democratic elected officials because of their views on abortion.  No other Church teachings – those against racism, unjust war, the devaluation of a person’s humanity through torture, or the denial of adequate health care – receive this level of attention from these bishops.  The denial of Communion, which is at the heart of our faith as Catholics, is considered a subtle form of excommunication from the Church. [What shabby thinking.]  This controversy has never materialized in Europe, where Pope John Paul II often gave Communion to Catholic heads of state who opposed the criminalization of abortion.

While the bishops have a necessary role in articulating moral principles and values, it is the legitimate role of the laity to determine – through the political process – what is prudent, what is possible, and how to apply the principles of faith to concrete situations in matters of public policy.  See "Holy Communion and Unholy Politics" by Rev. John Beal, professor of Canon Law at the Catholic University of America, in America Magazine.  Also, see Chris Matthews’s interview of Bishop Tobin on MSNBC’s Hardball arguing these points with the bishop. [Look who they hold up as examples.]
The announcement of Bishop Tobin banning [Is that what he did?  Or is this a lie?] Rep. Kennedy from Communion followed Bishop Tobin’s escalation of a public disagreement between the two leaders on a matter of public policy related to health care reform and abortion.  In his newspaper column of November 12, 2009, the bishop ridiculed Representative Kennedy after they had agreed to keep the matter private until they met in person. [But… Rep. Kennedy is the one who made this all public first.  Right?]  The bishop’s letter was issued five days after the passage of the House health care reform bill, which contains language supported by the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops restricting the availability of health care coverage for abortion services on the Exchange.  Congressman Kennedy voted for the bill.


This group is disgusting.

Do you remember before the last presidential election I posted here a memo circulated by a Democrat committee in Indiana with talking points about how to shift the moral debate about abortion to become a political issue?  To politicize they debate?

About Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

Fr. Z is the guy who runs this blog. o{]:¬)
This entry was posted in SESSIUNCULA, The Drill, The future and our choices and tagged , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink.


  1. medievalist says:

    “A majority of Catholics hold views similar to Congressman Kennedy…”

    To a non-Catholic, this means the Church’s teachings should change. To a Catholic, this means that bishops and priests have done a poor job of catechesis.

    What are pretty mendacious are the attempts to say that the bishops are against health-care reform full stop. Catholic bishops are one of the few groups that has consistently called for health-care reform. They have not sought to dictate, but to influence, like countless other groups and lobbies. If people think that the Church is dictating health-care reform, when, in truth, they have been fighting tooth and nail just to be heard at all, then there’s either been alot of kool-aid consumed or people are outright slandering the Church. I prefer to be charitable and advocate the former option.

  2. Catherine says:

    I find it pretty pathetic that these fools actually believe they can influence Bishop Tobin as regards changing his stance. As you hinted in a not-so-subtle manner, Fr. Z., two can play that game. Our voices must ring out loud and clear that we are a significant force and that we WILL be heard.

  3. edwardo3 says:

    Sounds like the old heresey of Americanism to me… wasn’t that condemned in the early 19th century? And why is it that if a man decided to call himself Catholic, he goes unquestioned in his Catholicism, but if a Bishop (who should have a little bit to say about such issues)directly says that a man’s communion with the Church is diminished because of the man’s anti-Catholic views and positive actions, the Bishop is automatically in err? Is the world really that upside down. Maybe it would help if Bishops actually started using the ceremonies of Excommunication as a real and tangible example of how diminished a man’s communion with the Church is when he thinks and acts against the most basic and fundamental truths held by the Church. Again, no one is ever forced into the Church and no one is ever forced out of the Church, both are individual choices, and sometimes, the Church has to make it known that some choices are never acceptable.

  4. Girgadis says:

    This is what happens when the Kennedys are permitted to define what it means to be Catholic in America. Ted Kennedy’s funeral did nothing to correct that myth either.

  5. edwardo3: I agree with you. One hundred percent.
    “Americanism’ (read: liberal Protestantism) has been with us since the founding of this country.
    In my next door Archdiocese of Minneapolis/St. Paul, one of the strongest proponents of this was Bishop Ireland; the effects of this in the Midwest, as well as in the Northeast, is incredible.
    It looks good to those who are not spiritually grounded in the universal Catholic mindset/truth.
    But politics and religion cannot be intermixed or the grounds for compromise. Either it is true or it is not. Polls and debating are worthless. God is the arbiter of Truth. Submission of mind and will on our part is the only way.

  6. Salvatore_Giuseppe says:

    “Since 2004, a small but vocal minority of bishops – whose political views are closely aligned with the Republican Party”

    History lesson: The Catholic Church(and its moral viewpoints) precede the Republican Party

    It is therefore incorrect to say that their political views are closely aligned with the Republican Party, but rather that the Republican Party is closely aligned with the moral views of the Catholic Church.

  7. EXCHIEF says:

    The plus is that for years these liberal not so very catholic groups went unchallenged. They had the ear of the MSM and their views were often broadcast by the media as being official church views–which of course they are not. Just like the womens’ religious orders that were allowed, for decades, to do their own (not so catholic) thing unchallenged.

    Now, thank God, the liberal not so catholic groups, which includes the liberal not so catholic religious orders, are (FINALLY) being challenged by Church leadership. Something that, indeed, they are not used to or comfortable with.

    Expect the more that Bishops speak out and emphasize orthodoxy the more the left wing not so catholics will scream. Perhaps, and I hope this is true, this is their death rattle. Pray that the new generation of Bishops and Priests continues to challenge deviations from true Catholic teaching and to do it in the public square particularly when deviant politicians are involved.

  8. Peggy R says:

    Now, wait a minute. These jokers are allowed to take Catholic social teaching into the public square but Bp. Tobin or other bishops who don’t agree with them are not. Is that right, “Catholic” Dems? Weasels.

  9. Gail F says:

    I looked at the website and it is, of course, distressing (but not surprising). However, I don’t see this anywhere on the website. Has it been taken down? Or was it from somewhere else entirely?

  10. taad says:

    People have forgotten that Bishop Tobin took on Republican Rudy Giuliani a few years ago when he was running for President. The article in the paper for the Providence Diocese was called “MY RSVP to Rudy Giuliani” which was critical of the Mayors pro-abortion stance. Here’s part of what Bishop Tobin wrote then in 2007:

    Rudy’s explanation is a classic expression of the position on abortion we’ve heard from weak-kneed politicians so frequently in recent years:

    “I’m personally opposed to but don’t want to impose my views on other people.” The incongruity of that position has been exposed many times now. As I’ve asked previously, would we let any politician get away with the same pathetic cop-out on other issues: “I’m personally opposed to . . . racial discrimination, sexual abuse, prostitution, drug abuse, polygamy, incest . . . but don’t want to impose my beliefs on others?”

    Why is it that when I hear someone explaining this position, I think of the sad figure of Pontius Pilate in the Gospels, who personally found no guilt in Jesus, but for fear of the crowd, washed his hands of the whole affair and handed Jesus over to be crucified. I can just hear Pilate saying, “You know, I’m personally opposed to crucifixion but I don’t want to impose my belief on others.”

    Interestingly, he asks the question I think all of us want answered: Why does Rudy “hate abortion” and believe it’s morally wrong?

    I’ll bet this is the last “Rudy for President” function Bishop Tobin receives.

  11. Nan says:

    NP, Abp. Ireland’s suppression of the Byzantine Rite is something that’s still contentious after all these years, yet he did some very good things in instituting Catholic Universities and encouraging Catholics to populate farming communities in Minnesota.

    Every time I have been to Calvary Cemetery, where he’s buried, I’ve seen flowers or candles left on his grave, yet I have mixed feelings about him, re: damage done by suppressing Rite.

  12. Dr. Eric says:

    I just sent an e-mail in support of His Excellency to the Diocese of Providence Office of Communications.

    Rep. Kennedy’s office will also be getting a call, but not the kind of call that the writer of the article would want.

  13. Nan: You are correct, in my estimation.
    There is something that needs to be sorted out in all of this; we live in the United States of America. But does that mean we have to suppress our Catholic identity (Byzantine or Roman) to the powers that be?
    We’ll be sorting this out in the Third Millennium, I am sure. Better look to the English recusants, in my humble opinion.

  14. al007italia says:

    I wonder what this gang would think of statement issued by the Spanish Bishops Conference that they issued on Friday. There is a bill being considered in the Spanish parliament that would make it easier to get an abortion in Spain by allowing 16-year olds to get an abortion without parental consent & other parts would expand access to abortion even more. The bishops said that politicians who vote for a bill so contrary to the “requirements of right reason” publicly place themselves in a state of sin and ought not to receive Communion.

    Soif I read the Ctholic Democrats claim rightly, are they also showing a “preference for the Republican positions” like Tobin?

    Anyhow, why should they let the truth get in the way of their agenda?

  15. Clinton says:

    Since the Jim Crow laws mandating segregation throughout the South were written, passed and enforced by Democrats, does
    that mean that these “Catholic Democrats” would have written a similar letter to the Bishop of New Orleans? I believe Archbishop
    Rummel began desegregation of his parochial schools in the early 1950’s and had to threaten excommunication of several
    Democratic politicians, and indeed excommunicate a Judge before he finished the job.

    So let’s see… we have in +Rummel an Archbishop who made no secret of his opposition to the Democrat’s stand on maintaining
    segregation. A majority of Louisiana Catholics may have held views similar to their Democratic politicians. Were “Catholic Democrats”
    around then, I suppose they’d write that they “believe Archbishop Rummel’s personal political views are driving actions that are not
    only hurtful to the Catholics of Louisiana but also to the larger Church–as well as fueling the political divisions across the

    I would love to hear from one of these so-called “Catholic Democrats” just how they could say that Archbishop Rummel could
    be so obviously right to do what he did yet Bishop Tobin is not.

  16. Jack Hughes says:

    Am I the only one who think’s that its time to start condemmming with bell,book and candle?

  17. JARay says:

    Jack Hughes! Indeed you are NOT the only one who thinks that it is time to start condemning with the right and proper sanctions which the Church has at her disposal.

  18. Wanderer says:

    This seems to potentially have the same circular reasoning as the affair in Connecticut:

    Faction of Democratic Party deems that Catholic Church needs liberal “over site”. The goal is to weaken a perceived socio political opponent. The faction then advances legislation to force the over site. The legislation is then determined to have serious constitutional flaws.

    But, When the church protests the unconstitutional legislation, the Democratic faction threatens the tax exempt status for “political involvement”.

    Congressman makes public statements against the church that are not only inaccurate, but partisan. Church re affirms an internal policy clearly protected by Freedoms of Speech and Religion.

    But, A Democratic Faction declares the Church’s actions to be “political”. Is the next step threatening the tax exemption status due to declared “political” involvement?

  19. james says:

    First of all, the authors of this junk are correct – many Catholics do hold the same views as the Kennedys clan. But they are baptised Catholics only – not practicing Catholics, many on the cusp of apostasy, such as the Kennedy’s, Pelosi, Biden, others…

    Second, I don’t think Bishop Tobin speaks as a Republican, but as a true Catholic. His views are not political, but Catholic, unlike the political apostates who penned this poison…

    Finally, you can’t be Catholic and support what the Kennedy’s stand for. As for the Republican Party being politically aligned with Catholics… What would Mr. Belloc and Mr. Chesteron have to say about today’s Republican Party? I think that’s obvious. Catholics should read more Belloc and Chesterton when it comes to socio-political and economic issues. Whilst from the past, the their writings could have been crafted this morning, if one were to exempt each authors’ name. Neither would support the Republican Party in it’s present (and past) state.

    Another ecxcellent read, Fr. John Hardon SJ – “The Influence of Marxism in the United States Today”. The authors of the Kennedy Manifesto sound more like Marxists than Catholics. Perhaps they are? From Fr. Hardon, SJ:

    “The best single analysis of Marxism is the encyclical on Atheistic Communism by Pope Pius XI in which he identifies Marxism as a ‘Utopian Messianism,’ …the United States has been deeply infected by Marxism. However, I believe we can say even more. Our country is a Marxist nation, Dare I say still more? The United States of America is the most powerful Marxist country in the world.” Fr. John Hardon SJ – “The Influence of Marxism in the United States Today”.

  20. irishgirl says:

    Just sent an email of support to Bishop Tobin.

    These so-called ‘catholic dems’ ARE weasels-good name for them, Peg!

    Hey Jack Hughes-I’m with you! Our Bishops have to ‘do a Becket’ and formally, PUBLICALLY excommunicate these idiots!

  21. VivaLaMezzo says:

    “We also believe that it is important to urge Bishop Tobin to put his pastoral responsibilities ahead of his political views and to focus on helping pass health care reform legislation.”

    Huh? Wow… this statement nearly gave me whiplash! It could have easily said, “Keep out unless you want to play by our rules.” It reminds me of the time I saw a welcome mat that said f— off.

  22. relee54 says:

    Satan must be planning to add some room in the inferno for members of this group.

    We need more bishops in this country like Bishop Tobin who are taking their role as shepherd of their flock seriously.

  23. iudicame says:

    Why are we constantly harping on this abortion thing? Lighten-up people – the pope just got himself a new ferula [OK – maybe not as cool as the Pius IX ferula but its the bomb nonetheless]


  24. caterham says:

    The nation was founded in error. Looks like it will end in error too.

  25. Vincentius says:

    Rhode Island is both the most Catholic state (>60% or ~600,000 nominal Catholics) and the most Democtrat state ( large majorities of both branches of the state legislature continuously since 1940) and yet the state Democratic Party has made no official pronouncement on the Tobin-Kennedy flap. I wonder what that’s all about. The Republican Catholic pro-life governor has publically and unequivocably sided with the Bishop, and Kennedy’s colleague in the only other RI Congessional district- a pro-life Democratic Catholic has tiptoed around the issue

  26. Be sure to look at this: http://votingcatholicin2008.blogspot.com/2009/11/fr-z-on-catholic-democrat-cronies.html

    I am posting from my phone, so I did this the messy way.

  27. Supertradmom says:

    As this group is not holding to the Teachings of the Magisterium, I suggest that the Bishops condemn it. I am sure they have the power to do this. What is sad is this disjoint in these people’s hearts and minds as to the teaching and tender care of the Catholic Church for life, versus the political expediencies they seem to face. Very worrying….

  28. ALL: You will have read in the main entry that Sycophantic Toadies will even write your letter to the editor for you – 250 poisonous words designed to weaken Catholic identity in the public square by attacking strong bishops.

    How about some of you posting here your own template?

    Or send them to me by email and I will create an entry from them?

    250 words or less.  That’s what Catholic Dems suggest as being amenable to editors.

    Catholic Dems (aka Sycophantic Toadies) probably has … what … maybe even tens of readers.

    WDTPRS has thousands on a light day!

    Bloggers UNITE!

    Let’s get the good Catholic blogosphere fired up.

    Let’s get off the bench.

  29. Supertradmom says:

    As my small town newspaper sends out the paper to only about 5,000 people, I feel that a template for that reason is not applicable here. But, I think that letters to the local, diocesan newspapers would be valuable. Some of the diocesan newspapers are actually run by Catholic Dems, as I know from experience. Perhaps letters to those papers would help. I would suggest this template, and please feel free to change it:

    Dear Editor,

    As seen on the Catholic Democrats website, there is a confusion concerning the position of Bishop Tobin and Patrick Kennedy. There is also a confusion as to the position of bishops regarding the pastoral care they give to the members of the local Catholic Church. On the website, the author neglected to state that Representative Kennedy publicized Bishop Tobin’s pastoral guideline, that if Kennedy was not following the teachings of the Catholic Church regarding life issues, he should not present himself for Communion. Bishop Tobin did not make public his pastoral concern until Kennedy went to the press. That a bishop has a duty to guide his members of his diocese is known to all. Pastoral concern is part of the loving care our pastors provide.

    Secondly, the issue of any religious leader taking some sort of stand in the public sphere is not new in the United States. Since the 19th century, the bishops of the United States have taken public positions on labor laws, labor unions, civil rights, immigration and other timely issues. Some of these teachings given by the Church through her bishops became laws in the United States. The guidance of bishops and priests in matters of Constitutional rights is a precedent, not a deviation, nor a confusion of the separation of Church and State, which the Catholic Democrats do not seem to understand. Where the teaching of the Catholic Church corresponds to perserving and defending the rights of those who are vulnerable in our society, the bishops have spoken out publically, both as a groups and as individuals.

    In writing this letter, I support Bishop Tobin in his decision to help Representative Kennedy in his journey as a Catholic, and in the Bishop’s subsequent statements in the media. Thank you for considering this letter, from a Catholic who is concerned about the misrepresentation of facts on the Catholic Democrats website.

    Sincerely, [300+ words – good showing, but let’s get it down under +250 so they don’t edit out your good stuff! o{];¬) ]

  30. Supertradmom says:

    P.S, I wrote an encouraging e-mail to Bishop Tobin a few days ago through his diocesan website. I hope all the bloggers and commentators do so.

  31. Girgadis says:

    hmmm, funny you should ask….the following is the letter I sent off to the Philadelphia Inquirer yesterday after their lead op-ed piece attacked the church for asking Catholic politicians to adhere to their faith. To date, I’ve not heard from them about whether or not they will print it. At any rate, I welcome constructive criticism for future letters and hope there is perhaps something here that someone else might find useful. The link to the op-ed in question is here, if anyone is of a mind to write.


    To the Editor:

    By your November 27 editorial, I can see that you don’t get it any more than Representatives Kennedy and Murphy do. Faith is not something you put aside for political gain. When a Catholic chooses to run for office, they are well aware of the separation of church and state. This does not mean they are not compelled to defend their faith in the public arena. Both of these representatives voted against a measure that would remove abortion funding from the House version of the bill on health care reform. It is not the law of the land that abortion be funded with federal tax dollars or that health care workers be forced to act against their consciences and participate in abortions. That is a very expansive view of Roe v Wade.

    What’s more, Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius not only supports abortion rights but she accepted thousands of dollars in campaign contributions from a notorious late-term abortionist. She was under no legal obligation to accept this blood money but she took it anyway. Her bishop’s primary responsibility is not, as some might think, to a political party, but to the souls of the flock he was appointed to shepherd, hers included.

    If Catholic politicians don’t want to uphold the Church’s teachings, they should stop calling themselves Catholic and find another church where their views will not only be welcomed but embraced. Change the subject from abortion to slavery or racism and ask yourself how many of these pols would be on board if either of those evils were “the law of the land”.


  32. albizzi says:

    “This controversy has never materialized in Europe, where Pope John Paul II often gave Communion to Catholic heads of state who opposed the criminalization of abortion”.

    This may look insidious of course, but they are right in reminding it.
    If the Church (and the Pope himself first)had spoken “una voce” & clearly on the issue since the beginning the controversy would be over since decades.
    Moreover there are a lot of bishops who don’t agree with Mgr Tobin and will continue giving communion to such politics.

  33. …Bishop Tobin returned to a divisive path.

    The best way to tell if you’re arguing with a liar and a would-be tyrant is if he accuses you of being divisive.

  34. edwardo3 says:

    Nazareth Priest,

    Agreed, one of the worst proponents of Americanism was Bishop Ireland, however; I have read that Archbishop Carroll was taken to task for his tendencies in this regard asking Rome for such things as the Mass and Office in the vernacular so that we Catholics wouldn’t be so distinct from our protestant countrymen. In all of this I keep thinking of St. Thomas a Becket and how he would handle this situation. Maybe we really do need a Primate of the United States of America.

  35. isabella says:

    Before I write Bishop Tobin, I have two questions if somebody could help me.

    1. Does Bishop Tobin’s staff have the political savvy to sort out the mass mailings that are from organized Catholic Democrats for Death, whatever? Whenever I write one of my senators, his staff will only respond with a form letter if my letter even *resembles* part of an organized campaign – they know what is going on out there. So I make very sure my letter looks like I personally wrote it.

    There is software to do this — that’s how teachers keep student from turning in a plagiarized term paper from the internet — although I doubt a bishop would have it since he isn’t a politician. Some of the teachers in the diocese might be willing to use it on his behalf, though.

    2. I think a template would be a bad idea for the above reasons. We will look as dishonest as they do. Would it be a better idea to send him the evidence that the other template exists? Best case, it could discredit EVERYTHING he gets from the evil ones.

    And I am about to email him a short note of support, to be followed up by a longer letter. Am just curious about what I asked though. Don’t want to tell him something he already knows, but I wish he were my bishop. I see him more as St Thomas More.

Comments are closed.