Thrones

The throne used by His Holines for the consistory has been used before!


 

 

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About Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

Fr. Z is the guy who runs this blog. o{]:¬)
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23 Responses to Thrones

  1. Pistor says:

    The physical representation of hermenutic of continuity… Gotta love it!

  2. TJM says:

    Habemus Papam! Deo gratias, Tom

  3. James says:

    Where are you finding these beautiful pictures???

  4. Berolinensis says:

    Yes, as I commented below (http://wdtprs.com/blog/2007/11/vestments-for-a-consistory/#comment-39224), the Holy Father already used this throne for his last Christmas address to the Curia, but as far as I know, this is the first time this throne was used for a liturgy inside St. Peter’s for quite a long time. Now, if only it could be moved back to the apse, in front of the Cathedra, where it belongs.
    See: http://www.catholicpressphoto.com/servizi/2006-12-22-auguri-natale/images/prevs/2006-12-22%20BXVI%20end-of-year%20speech%2002.jpg

  5. Thanks to Father Z for these pictures of the papal throne by Pope Benedict.

    I totally agree with Beroliniensis :
    If only it could be moved back to the apse, in front of the Cathedra, where it belongs.

    Yes.
    I hope Mons. Guido Marini is reading this.

  6. Habemus Papam says:

    Berolinensis, do you know when this Throne was removed from the Cathedra?
    (I think John Paul I was photographed seated in this Throne and he was the last to use the Sedia Gestatoria).

  7. dcs says:

    Has anyone ever seen Fr. Z. and Msgr. Marini in the same room at the same time?

  8. Hung Doan says:

    Pistor you hit the nail on the head! There are noticeable and subtle changes and it is inspiring! More reverence where reverence is due and more pomp when pomp is due!

  9. Bob says:

    I notice from the various photos accross the web that there is no Cross on the altar, simply the six candles. Is this significant?

  10. kal says:

    Maybe no cross on the altar because there was no Mass?

  11. prof. basto says:

    This throne was a moveable throne even in the good old days. It was not
    fixed at the apex of the Basilica, where Bernini’s Cathedra Petri stands.

    A portable baldacchino with steps
    used to be placed in front of the Cathedra Petri
    on the days when a Papal Mass was to be celebrated in the
    Altar of the Confession, and then this throne or some other moveable throne
    was placed within that structure, under the baldacchino.

    For John XXIII’s Coronation, for instance, another throne was placed in
    the apex of the basilica, under a baldacchino and with steps leading up
    to it, and with a cloth behind it, and the Throne used today by Pope Benedict
    was the one placed in the balcony of the Basilica, where the actual
    Coronation took place.

    Pope Pius XII was also crowned while seated in the Throne used today, and
    that also took place in the balcony of the Basilica.

  12. techno_aesthete says:

    What a great image of Leo XIII; a good find.

  13. Michael says:

    That is actually a photo of Saint Pius X.

  14. I think the throne was made for Leo XIII.

  15. Habemus Papam says:

    Correction to my previous post: John Paul I was photographed in a Throne used by Paul VI and NOT the Throne discussed in this thread.

  16. Ottaviani says:

    Prof. Basto – are you sure John XXIII was crowned inside St. Peter’s and not on the balcony? There is a Youtube video here and it looks like the coronation was outside.

  17. prof. basto says:

    Ottaviani,

    I have said in my post that the Coronation took place at the balcony.

    Please note my words:

    “…and the Throne used today by Pope Benedict
    was the one placed in the balcony of the Basilica, where the actual
    Coronation took place.

  18. Francis Brennan says:

    Fr. Z.,

    Despite Pope Bendict’s eschewal of it in his papal insignia, I can’t help thinking that the logical corollary of the use of this throne must eventually be the reintroduction of the tiara. After Paul VI laid his tiara aside at the end of Vatican II, there could be no better signal than the revival of the tiara that continuity, and not rupture, is the key to understanding and implementing the Council.

  19. Ad Orientem says:

    Francis Brennan,
    If the Pope has hopes of restoring communion with Orthodoxy I can think of no faster way to wreck such hopes then by bringing back the tiara. I approve of most of what this Pope has done and appears to be doing. But the tiara is a symbol of the ultramontane attitudes of another era which are deeply offensive to the Orthodox.

    ICXC NIKA
    John

  20. Maria says:

    (jaw drops) Thank you, Father!

    —————————————————–

    \”Has anyone ever seen Fr. Z. and Msgr. Marini in the same room at the same time?\”

    HAHA!

  21. PMcGrath says:

    A simple, practical question here: Where would this throne have been stored? And who would have known its significance, and have been able to find it for such use?

    Same question applies to the miter and the cope.

  22. SMJ says:

    PMcGrath,

    I think it was in the Lateran Museum.

  23. Timothy James says:

    PMcGrath,
    Maybe it was in the same place all the beautiful vestments were hiding under the reign of Marini I.