ORDINARY form in Glasgow: images

You should check out this page with photos and clips of the Ordinary form of Holy Mass celebrated in the Glaswegian Diocese.

A sample:

[youtube:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EQbnGi6NCI]

I am very concerned that the TLM will in ome cases shove the Ordinary form, the Novus Ordo entirely into the vernacular.  I hope the gravitational pull works its wonders.

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27 Responses to ORDINARY form in Glasgow: images

  1. Mark M says:

    Father,

    It was my understanding that that wasn’t the TLM. St Patrick’s Anderston celebrates the Novus Ordo in Latin.

  2. Kradcliffe says:

    I didn’t know they celebrated the EF at St. Patrick’s… but I know that altar server! We’ll have to ask him.

  3. Beowulf says:

    It says at the beginning it is the Ordinary Form.

  4. Fr G says:

    Its certainly Ordinary Form. St Patrick’s Anderston, Glasgow, every Sunday at 4pm. All Welcome. The TLM is available at Sacred Heart, Bridgeton, celebrated by Rt Rev Monsignor Hugh Canon Boyle.

  5. Irulats says:

    “….hoc est enim corpus meum, quod pro vobis tradetur.”

    Ordinary Form reverently read.

  6. Aleph says:

    Anyway it can’t be the TLM – surely no priest, let alone a young priest, of the Archdiocese of Glasgow would dare celebrate the TLM after Archbishop Conti’s much publicised opinions on that Mass.

  7. Kradcliffe says:

    Fr G, we’d love to come, sometime. But, we’re out in Dumbarton and if we drive into town for the TLM at Sacred Heart, we’re not likely to drive back down later that afternoon. Hmmmm…. maybe I’ll have to split masses with my husband some weekend.

  8. Fr G says:

    Its understandable why people would want to get back to Dumbarton as soon as possible…

    Of course, St patrick’s isn’t trying to “steal people” away from Sacred Heart, its hoping rather to intrdouce people to the fullness of the Church’s liturgy in Latin who would otherwise have no experience of it.

  9. a religious says:

    I hope that one day the ordinary and extraordinary foroms of the Roman rite will be accorded the same treatment by Archbishop Conti, who, with great respect, should study the new Motu Proprio more diligently. I think he has publicised the Mass at St. patrick’s as a Mass ‘for foreigner visitors to Glasgow’. Are the intercessions in different languages ? In any case, whatever the thoughts of His Grace on his role as the chief liturgist of his diocese, I wish the celebrants of the Holy Mass in St. Patrick’s and the congregation every success for a prayerful and dignified celebration of the ordinary form, so badly needed in the west of Scotland.

  10. Ttony says:

    It’s nice to see that whoever has arranged to film this has simply put a camera on a tripod and has pressed the “On” switch. Much nicer for those attendig …

  11. I would say there is no danger of the increasing number of celebrations of the “old” Mass shoving the Novus Ordo into the vernacular.

    On the contrary, people, especially young people, are showing an increased interest in the Latin language.
    The Pope himself has shown how the Novus Ordo may be celebrated facing “ad Deum”, even at the old high altar, completely in accord with the liturgical norms.

    The Novus Ordo Mass doesn’t have to be celebrated “facing the people” or in the vernacular. It never did have to be celebrated in that way.

    Summorum Pontificum has returned traditional worship to the very heart of the Church’s public worship.
    It isn’t going to make Novus Ordo celebrations even worse.
    It’s going to make them better.

    Fr. Z is right about the gravitational pull, although it’s going to take time.

    There is no cause for concern.

  12. Gordon says:

    This is a mass for everyone & anyone. It is also the only weekly Latin New Mass in Scotland(that I am aware of in a diocesan church) outside Pluscarden Abbey in Moray which does everything in Latin, Offices included, but is in the middle of nowhere & not easy to get to. I think for this mass, the ceremonial could be improved. I would like to see M.C assist the priest during the incensing of altar & especailly be at his side during the canon. ( He did do this last week) I would keep the thurifer in till the Pater Noster instead of leaving right after the consecration. I guess these are small pionts. I was pleased to see far more ppl in for the mass these past 2 Sundays, but it is sad we can only have it in this one church in Latin (apart from the old mass at Sacred Heart,) & only on Sundays. We have nothing on offer for any other days, like Ascension Day on Thursday. Will not be there this week, but hope to be most Sundays.While I would rather the old mass, it is good that they are doing this at all. I think it is indeed a wonderful thing regardless.

  13. richard says:

    Is’nt this how the NO is to be done, according to the documents of Vatican II? The same rituals as the extraordinary form, facing the Lord,leading the people in prayer,with reverence?Unfortunately, certain seditious elements within the church read what they wanted, and manhandled the mass into a thoroughly protestantized, hippy-dippy, how-great-we-art,lets dance about the altar travesty which drove most catholics somewhere, anywhere, else, wondering where the church had gone wrong.Such antics have also emptied out more mainstream protestant churches.Every sunday I enter our church hoping to see that some element of the reform has slipped under the door; is there the benedictine arrangement, chant,incese? Hopefully the day is near when this is how it will be…and still certain seditious elements are at work, miss-catechizing,women-priesting,liturgically dancing the holy church into schism…the American Catholic Church? I’ll stick with rome, thank you…

    ,etc. Unfortnately, certain seditious elements within the church manhandled it into a purely protestantized hippy dippy whoopy how-great-we-art travesty.

  14. Zach says:

    I’ve been serving the traditional Mass for so long that I think it’s the oddest sight to have the elevation without a server lifting the base of the chasuble. Is there any specific rubric that prevents it in the NO? If not, it should be brought back to it. It is a very powerful symbolic gesture.

  15. Gordon says:

    Totally agrees with Zach. I don’t think there is anything against it in the new rules. It may well be down to what the set custom has become in most places.

  16. Tom says:

    Excellent! This is the way forward.

    Now, let me ask a question now that you mention the lifting of chasuble during elevation. I never understood why this is done. I tried searching for it, but in vain. Can anyone please explain it to me? Thank you! :-)

  17. Jordanes says:

    What I was told — I don’t know if this true — is that the vestments of the priests used to be pretty thick and heavy, so the priest would sometimes be helped so he wouldn’t have as much weight to lift. Later the vestments became lighter, so the gesture was no longer needed, but by then it had become a traditional, symbolic gesture of service and concern for one’s priest.

  18. John Enright says:

    Tom:

    To answer your question, the server lifts the Priest’s or Bishop’s chasuble simply to make the elevation of the host or chalice easier. See Canon of the Mass:

    “The server also lifts up the chasuble with his left hand at the elevation, not at the genuflexion (Rubr. gen., VIII, 6). This is to keep back the vestment (which the rubrics always suppose to cover the arms) while the priest elevates. With a modern Roman-shaped chasuble it is a mere form, and a memory of better days. As soon as the celebrant rises from the second genuflexion he continues the Consecration prayer.”

  19. TerryC says:

    Unfortuantely, in many places, the OF has been exclusively in the vernacular for these forty years. It’s wonderful to see it celebrated more widely in Latin in recent years. As more priest become more comfortable in Latin (with the hope that the Holy See will press the seminaries in this regard) I hope to see the ordinary form celebrated more widely in Latin or partially in Latin.

  20. J. C. Oberholzer says:

    The Novus Ordo Mass has been offered in the Cathedral Basilica of Saints Peter and Paul in Philadelphia in Latin on the 1st and 3rd Sundays of the month (Sept. thru May) for at least the 15 years during which I have been present. Very reverent, very beautiful music, choir and organ, beautiful cathedral. http://www.sspeterpaulcathedral.catholicweb.com

  21. Aumgn says:

    Gordon,

    from what I gather, the MC would very much like to assist the Priest at the Canon every week (though not during the Incensation, where the Priest requires no practical help – seeing as chasubles are typically light these past centuries and the celebrants in Saint Patrick’s are all young :) ) but is faced with not having enough servers and needing to do the thurible himself a good part of the time.

    As to the thurifer and torchbearers leaving after the consecration: if anything that’s an example of the Old Rite, at least how it’s typically celebrated in Glasgow, influencing the New. Yes, it would be nice for the Torchbearers alone to wait through the Canon to the conclusion of public communion, a practice I’ve seen myself, but Saint Patrick’s doesn’t really have the leg-room.

  22. Gordon says:

    Perhaps I should go back to serving again…Still have my cotta.Soutane got left in the last place….Not a half mile from St.Patricks! Could always get a new one

  23. Glaswegian says:

    Thanks for publicising this, Fr Z. Apparently this Mass is under threat if the attendance isn’t boosted, so anyone reading this blog within a 20 mile radius of Glasgow who can make the effort to attend, even once a month, would really help.

    It is a beautiful celebration, very conducive to active participation – as opposed to my local parish church in Glasgow where ‘active participation’ means reciting the words of Consecration along with the priest. I am very close to reporting this to His Grace the Archbishop, but would appreciate any advice on the best way to do so.

  24. Glaswegian: I suggest you also get on the phone, call people, and even offer to drive. If what you say is true, then you need a “get out the attendance” drive.

  25. Jimmy says:

    Glaswegian: from what I hear you’re right. If the numbers don’t go up, its hard to justify the expense of haeting and lighting the church and, more importantly, to justify the priests involved celebrating what is for them soemtimes a third or fourth Sunday Mass.

  26. Craigmaddie says:

    Well, the last two weeks there have been 35-40 people, which is a definite improvement! I think the problem has been trying to get the word out about the Mass. There has been a concerted effort recently to do this and it has been bearing fruit I think. Last Sunday the celebrant was a visiting French priest, Msgr Blois from the CDW, who offered Mass in a very beautiful, solemn way.

    I tend to attend both forms of Mass in Glasgow – in the morning I attend the Extraordinary Form at the Sacred Heart and in the afternoon I sing in the schola at the Ordinary Form at St Patrick’s. I don’t believe that there is any ‘conspiracy’ to steal people away from the EF. Rather, I think it, on the contrary, helps bring the traditional Mass out of the ghetto into which it was pushed here in the Archdiocese.

  27. D. S. says:

    Laudetur JS CHS!

    As I posted before vernacular is not the main problem of the liturgical reform, it is not the essential and crucial difference between NOM and VOM. So I can only agree that the vernacular is not that bad, you can give good reasons for it. There are also reasons against it and you can discuss of corse.

    But it is not intrinsic a matter of faith, does not clearly contradict faith or support some heresy. It can. but it is not necessary so – and not that evident/clear.

    That is proofed by the fact that some Catholic rites do use the vernacular for Holy Mass or that (since Pius XII, I think) the vernacular is also allowed for an other important Sakrament, the Baptism (exept the words of the form and the exorcisms).

    And many Fathers on the V II were in favor of that; the missale of 1965 can be seeen as such an intended and not – cleraly – faith-offending so therefore acceptable reform.

    But if you consider the NOM (1969) then you see a reform that clearly is faith-offending by supporting some heresies. Doesn´t matter if it is in venarcular or latin. I was arguing for that several times before (see there). Some examples: using latin or vernarcular does not mind – ther is still the unacceptable textual and rubrical changes and omissions/eleminations, f. e.

    the new “offertory”-prayer [clearly heresy-supporting]
    the 2. Canon/Eucharistic prayer (and some more.. – there re more than 4!) [clearly...heresy-supporting]
    the heretic or at least absolutly evident heresy-promoting prayer for the Jews
    the new requiem-prayers, eleminating the word “soul” and mentions of devil and hell [clearly heresy-supporting]
    falling out/elemination of the knee bend immediatly after the consecration [clearly... -cf. Rev. P. Hönisch SJM - r.i.p]
    many omisssions of the saints, their intercession and merits [clearly... - the protestant heresy]

    [always "clearly" because not only proofed by the text itselfe, but also by circumstances and explicit statements of the reformers etc. - showing that clearly volitional/intended supporting this non-catholic teachings because of ecumenism.(can be proofed).]

    So like H.E. Archb. Lefebvre stated, he would either join the VO in vernarcular than the NO in latin, I can only agree.

    Don´t be so afraid of vernacular – but be afraid of all heresy or only supporting some!

    -Blessed be the the Virging Mary! -
    D.S.