ASK FATHER: Gloria and Creed for All Souls on Sunday?

From a reader…

The Canadian Bishops’ official Ordo clearly calls for the Gloria and the Creed on Sunday November 2. (Along with a note warning that the Sunday celebration shouldn’t be too penitential because it’s the Resurrection.)

But the Missal seems to say, pretty clearly, that the Gloria and Creed do not belong to the proper Mass for the day, and that Mass takes precedence of the Sunday (in the Ordinary form).

In this conflict, can the Bishops’ Ordo be right? Or can a Bishop determine such an “adjustment” to the liturgy for his own diocese?

I am a liturgical musician, so it matters practically. If you have time to comment, much thanks.

This is slightly schizo. But …!

The General Instruction says both the Gloria (GIRM 53) and the Creed (GIRM 68) may be sung or said “at particular celebrations of a more solemn character.”

Bishops can determine what constitutes “celebrations of a more solemn character”.  If they include All Souls (when it falls on a Sunday), then … hey!… who am I to judge?

Meanwhile, it’s jarring, to say the least.  The Sequence is tragically reduced to a mere option, but you can do a Gloria?  Really?  I will add that including a Gloria and Creed will make Mass longer, which will cut down on the time that Father Lovebeads for his homily.

On second thought, maybe it’s not a half-bad idea after all.

About Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

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  1. Gregorius says:

    Personally I don’t see why All Souls’ day needs to take precedence over the Sunday. I guess it’s just another way to make special feast days more ‘visible’ to the faithful who only attend Mass on Sundays…

  2. MAJ Tony says:

    Having not been to an OF All Souls on a Sunday in some time, I was unaware that a Gloria was even an option for All Souls. We know many things are not done in the 62 missal (Gloria, Alleluia, Gloria Patris, Credo, etc.) *

    I don’t know if the term is properly used here, but there seems to be much archaologism (term?) in the OF All Souls and Mass of Christian Burial, such as the allowability of these and the lack of the “dona eis requiem” etc. Below is a discussion of this on the CMAA website.

    *BTW, the translator of the 62 rubrics (the red pamphlet here put in html form courtesy of the SSJC in Chicago), Fr. Duvelius, former FSSP, assumed Bp. Etienne’s duties as VF of the Tell City (IN) deanery of the Archd of Indy. He was the FSSP apolstolate priest at Holy Rosary up through 2006 when he incardinated. He has made many positive changes wherever he has been, spreading the Usus antiquior and dewreckovating many churches.

  3. Fr AJ says:

    In the Ordo for our diocese in the United States, the Gloria is omitted but the Creed is said. I personally like All Souls on Sunday, my parishioners get to hear about Purgatory and see black vestments who otherwise would not go to Mass if it was another day in the week.

  4. wolfeken says:

    Gotta’ love novus ordo logic: black vestments on Sunday and white vestments at a funeral.

    And we wonder why Sundays have become just another day of the week…

  5. Geoffrey says:

    “Gotta’ love novus ordo logic: black vestments on Sunday and white vestments at a funeral.”

    I would think that when someone uses black vestments on All Soul’s Day when it falls on a Sunday, black vestments would also be used at funeral Masses. A Mass for the dead is a Mass for the dead.

    Meanwhile, in my parish, I bet the ordo will be ignored and the Gloria will be said…

  6. Mary Jane says:

    At our FSSP parish, All Souls will be observed on Monday the 3rd.

  7. Ohhhhh. I get it.
    The confusion expressed in this thread explains why a Traditional order nearby, the CRNJ, is saying All Souls on Nov 3 instead of Nov 2. I see now why a Requiem Mass on Sunday, the day honoring the Resurrection, doesn’t make any sense. Its Sunday, so there should be the Gloria and all that happy stuff. Typically, Catholics never have funerals on Sunday – why should we be observing All Souls Day on a Sunday? In the old E.F. calendar, it is sensible and simple to defer the day so that the Requiem can be observed correctly.

  8. Michelle F says:

    Tina in Ashburn: Thanks for your comment. I am the secretary for a Latin Mass community located in the same state as the CRNJ, and I think our priest did not realize that All Souls’ Day occurs on Monday instead of Sunday. I hadn’t looked at my FSSP calendar for next month, and he didn’t say anything this past Sunday about having Mass on Monday, so I just sent an email to him. You probably just saved us from a liturgical faux-pas!

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