In hour two of his program today, Rush vivisected Speaker Nancy Pelosi on what she said on Meet The Press.
UPDATE: Here is the transcript.
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RUSH: Let’s go to Pelosi. This was on Meet the Press yesterday. I want you to hear this, and we’ll comment after it. Tom Brokaw said, "Senator Obama saying the question of when life begins is above his ‘pay grade,’ when whether you’re looking at it ‘scientifically or theologically,’ if he were to come and say, ‘Help me out here Madam Speaker,’ what would you tell him?"
PELOSI: As an ardent practicing Catholic, uh, this is an issue that I have studied for a long time. And what I know is over the centuries, the doctors of the church have not been able to make that definition, and, uh, senator — uh, I’m — senator — Uh, St. Augustin’ (sic) said at three months. We don’t know. The point is is that it shouldn’t have an impact on a woman’s right to choose. Roe v. Wade talks about very clear definitions of when the child — uh, eh, er, first trimester, certain considerations second trimester, not so third trimester. The — the — there’s very clear distinctions.
RUSH: You know, folks, this is just embarrassing. As I’ve often wondered, is she genuinely this uneducated, uninformed, silly, stupid, whatever — and I’ve concluded there isn’t a word to describe the status of her brain. The Catholic Church doesn’t know? The Catholic Church hasn’t stipulated? The "doctors" at the Catholic Church? You mean the pope goes and consults the doctors to find out when life begins? Really? The doctors have more to say than God-d? I mean, Nancy, cite anybody. Don’t cite the Catholic Church. You’re putting them in an untenable position. You’re fixing it so every priest, no matter how wacko left the priest might be, cannot support you. Good grief, ladies and gentlemen! Life begins a conception. Where else can it begin?
Peggy Noonan had a great way — I’m going to have to paraphrase what she wrote — of reducing this to its most simple, its most elemental. If life doesn’t begin at conception, then why the hell wear a condom? If life doesn’t begin at conception, then why the hell take the pill? Well, the church doesn’t allow the pill. I know the church doesn’t allow the pill because life begins at conception — and the church is not cool on condoms, either, logoed or otherwise. But that’s the point. This is not something that we’ve been arguing about for centuries. St. Augustine said life begins at three months? St. Augustine knew that Roe vs. Wade was going to come along and basically say the same thing? Ed Morrissey, writing at the Hot Air blog, has done yeoman’s research into this.
He writes today: "The notion that the Catholic Church declared abortion a sin at the same time as the Pill is patently absurd, and shows that Pelosi has either lied about studying the issue in terms of Church history or lied about what she found. Church writings specifically naming abortion as murder appear as early as 70 AD in the Didache, the first written catechism of the Christian church: … ‘Tertullian, sometimes known as the Father of the Latin Church, wrote with equal clarity and force: "In our case, a murder being once for all forbidden, we may not destroy even the fetus in the womb, while as yet the human being derives blood from the other parts of the body for its sustenance.’" This is AD 179, the year 179, following year 70. "The Catholic catechism is extremely clear on the nature of its position on human life, and has been remarkably consistent on this point for almost 2,000 years, and it finds that position in the Old Testament. Human life begins at conception, not at birth, and not at some point consistent with Roe for convenience.
"In Psalm 51, David refers to his sinfulness beginning at the moment of conception, and sinfulness requires physical life and a soul to exist." So there you have it in the Old Testament. The Catholic Church has not thrown the Old Testament under the bus, the last time I looked. This is a giant embarrassment, or ought to be. Where’s Brokaw? Where is the media on this? She got away with this kind of inane, insane rambling, trying to fit one of the most sacred religious beliefs held by Catholics all over the world into a political issue that would conform with a rogue Supreme Court decision called Roe vs. Wade in 1973. Now, that is hubris. That is arrogance like I cannot believe. She has placed herself above the doctors of the church, above "St. Augustin," as she said. She has placed herself above the pope and everything the Catholic Church has ever said about this. And of course Brokaw just sits there, "Heh, heh, heh. Oh. Good." Well, that’s not entirely true. Brokaw did challenge her on this. I have to be honest. It’s with the natural gas business that he just sat there. He said, "But wait a minute, the Catholic Church at the moment feels she strongly that life begins at the point of conception."PELOSI: (mumbling) And this is, like, 50 years or something like that. So again, over the history, uh, of the church, this is an issue of, uh, controversy.
RUSH: No, it’s not an issue of controversy in the church. It’s an issue of controversy with the followers, with the parishioners, with the flock like you. Note the 50 years. I’ve always said, "A person’s historical perspective begins with the day they were born." So her use of 50 years there, "Well, it’s been a bone of contention, a controversy in the church for 50 years," meaning her adult life. That’s what she is relating it all to. Th-th-th– (sigh) I’m sorry to stutter, folks. I’m in stunned bewilderment and disbelief over what I consider to be not just stupidity and silliness but arrogance and hubris, and the ignorance that these people have over how this kind of comment is going to come back and bite her presidential nominee. I guess she thinks that she has to provide some sort of Democrat Party interpretation of Catholicism that permits Obama to get away with his infanticide belief.
BREAK TRANSCRIPT
RUSH: Now, look, don’t misunderstand me on this, folks. You’ve got a lot of liberal politicians who, for their own purposes, from Mario Cuomo to John Kerry to any number of them, will twist the Catholic Church’s doctrine abortion to fit their own personal desires to attach firmly the Democrat political policy dogma and this sort of thing. The way Cuomo did it, he did it at Notre Dame University, he went to Notre Dame University, and he said, "Of course I understand the sanctity of life, I’m pro-life and so forth, but I cannot impose my political will, my religious views on people. I cannot impose my religious views on the rest of the country." Yet he was perfectly comfortable imposing his tax views on the rest of the country and every other view he had. But it was just a cop-out to allow him to remain pure to Democrat policy. But Cuomo nor Kerry nor any of the others has ever come along and spoken for the Catholic Church like Pelosi did yesterday on Meet the Depressed. That’s the arrogance and hubris. I don’t care whether she said the Catholic Church’s doctors or doctrines, some people say she might have been saying doctrines, doesn’t matter. She was speaking for the Catholic Church, and that’s brazen. This is going to come back to bite. The, quote, unquote, third most powerful woman in the United States of America telling the world what the Catholic Church’s official position on life is, the church cannot let this stand. How they deal with it, we’ll just have to wait and see.
BREAK TRANSCRIPTRUSH: Joseph in Palm Coast, Florida, it’s great to have you on the program, sir.
CALLER: Hi.
RUSH: This place was in the path of Fay. You guys got a lot of rain up there, right?
CALLER: Turn it off. Hi.
RUSH: Hi.
CALLER: I’m a former Catholic priest and a Jesuit, and —
RUSH: Wait a minute. You have to educate me. What’s a former Catholic priest?
CALLER: I was dispense bid Pope Paul VI about 35 years ago from the automations of the priesthood.
RUSH: I see. Okay.
CALLER: But I’m still a priest, and times of emergency I can absolve from sin when someone’s in danger of death.
RUSH: I see. Last rites.
CALLER: Yeah. Yeah. But as to the theology, listening to Pelosi, she is misrepresenting what the Catholic church teaches. For one thing, the theologians don’t teach what the Catholic Church teaches unless it’s accepted by the church.
RUSH: I know.
CALLER: St. Augustine —
RUSH: You can go to Catholic encyclopedia, you can go anywhere you want. This is just a flat-out expedient political lie.
CALLER: Right but people don’t know that, the people don’t know how the church works.
RUSH: Well, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait. Just a second here, Joseph. Catholics know it, and there are a lot of them, and the Democrats are going to need ’em, and that’s one of the reasons they put Biden on the ticket, ’cause he’s a Catholic.
CALLER: Right.
RUSH: But this isn’t going to fly. The Catholics know what’s what.
CALLER: Right.
RUSH: They may get mad at the pope now and then, but Nancy Pelosi is not going to be accepted as redefining church doctrine no matter what their political points of view are.
CALLER: I don’t know. Some people might go along with her, but she’s misleading the public about where the church’s teaching comes from. The pope —
RUSH: She’s not "misleading." She’s lying!
CALLER: Okay. If you want to say that.
RUSH: I do want to say that.
CALLER: You know, Jesus Christ would not start a church that would lead men into error. That’s why the pope is "infallible in matters of faith and morals," and you can’t make an error when he officially teaches the Catholic doctrine. He can’t make an error. He can’t tell people something that’s going to lead them into error. And when the council defines something, it must first have the approval of the pope before it becomes official —
RUSH: Exactly.
CALLER: — Catholic doctrine.
RUSH: And the pope, as we all know, is not Nancy Pelosi. And we know that Pelosi would never be the pope. The question is, Pope Benedict is going to hear about this if he hasn’t. He cares. He’s the pope. He cares about the Catholic Church. The most powerful woman in the United States of America has just lied about his church. Something has to happen here at some point. I don’t know what. I don’t know what steps publicly the Catholic Church takes in a situation like this. But the first thing that is going to happen is, American Catholics are going to hear about it on this program, just like we have not forgotten, do you know that the Drive-By Media nowhere, no place, no how, has played Barack Obama when the cameras had shut down in Chester, Virginia, last week, praising China and its infrastructure? That has not made it to the Drive-Bys. It will, and if it doesn’t make it to the Drive-Bys it’s going to make it to the American people because we’re not going to let go of that, just like we’re not going to let go of this.
This is not just about abortion. This is about the hubris, brazen arrogance of a foolish, dangerous woman who as Speaker of the House is on a mission total folly; making a mockery of not only sacred beliefs, but common sense and intelligence on a daily basis. This is the woman who said that Obama is "a gift from God." His leadership and talents are a gift from God. So if that’s how they’re going to appeal to the values voters and if they want to bring abortion up, if they want to bring it up in this campaign we’re going to welcome it. We will welcome them bringing it up again. They cannot win on this, no matter how they fool themselves. The American people did not vote Roe vs. Wade. A bunch of liberal judges on the Supreme Court wearing black robes did it, and the American people have never had their say on it. And this is another way of liberals fool themselves into thinking they are the majority, when they are not.
END TRANSCRIPT
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Way to go Rush! He brought up early Church Father’s who came out against abortion in the first century.
Rush really went after the media after Pope John Paul’s death when they derisively portrayed PJP II as a “conservative”, when the Pope just follows truth, which never changes! Rush always credits Pope John Paul II, Ronald Reagan and Margaret Thatcher for bringing down Communism.
I feel as if I should go to confession for having so thoroughly enjoyed Rush’s ridiculing of Pelosi.
Now millions have heard of this travesty.
I guess even a broken clock is right twice a day… but I really don’t have much interest in what Rush says. He is an entertainer, not a thinker, and he doesn’t really add much value to the level of discourse in American culture.
Pelosi can easily be “vivisected” by far cleverer, more respectable people than Rush Limbaugh.
Did you ever think Tertullian would be quoted on mainstream talk radio?
Kradcliffe,
“Pelosi can easily be “vivisected” by far cleverer, more respectable people than Rush Limbaugh.”
So…where are all these “cleverer” people, to daily expose these people?
You just don’t like Limbaugh, and that’s fine. But why attack him, because you don’t agree with him most of the time?
He has a huge audience. You and your “cleverer” people do not.
Cut Away Rush!!
Semper Fi!
Kradcliffe,
Rush is “Right” 24 hours a day, b/c he sure isn’t left!
I also typically have little use for Rush. However I have to say the the level of actual journalism in the MSM is minuscule at best.
I watch CNN cover the latest he-said-he-said item on what Obama did as a State Senator dealin with Illinois version of the Born-Alive Infants Protection Act. We got to listen to Obama basically call the National Right to Life Committee liars. Then an opposing view was given by a conservative commentator. Never did CNN ever state what senate records said (which basically proved that Obama, not NRTL was lying.)
So on the Pelosi statement expect the MSM to dig up a left wing cleric to support her position and possibly an orthodox theologian to refute it all without ever actually looking at the actual writings of the early Church and stating what they say. After all, like modern religion, news is made up of opinions, not facts, because facts are subjective.
Kradcliffe,
Thank God it doesn’t take a “far cleverer thinker” to understand the evil of abortion. I am glad Rush spoke Catholic truth to his audience. How can Rush exposing Pelosi’s lies be anything but good? I pray that Rush becomes Catholic and benefits the Church, even more, in her divine mission.
James,
“I pray that Rush becomes Catholic.”
I second the motion. I’ve listened to Rush since I was prisoner in a Manhattan office of a major publisher twenty years ago where I used to get soundly thrashed on a daily basis by the purveyor’s of death. Rush was a refuge. Like some forgotten flotsam of the gulag, I’d quietly tilt my desktop transistor until I could get a reception in my little cubicle, and sit back and smile.
It’s astounding. I’ve heard Rush expound on the natural law like Garrigou-Lagrange, and yet he’s a lapsed Methodist who’s thrice-failed at marriage. He does have friends in high places though. He’s fast friends with Clarence Thomas and Bill Bennett, both solid Catholics with whom I’ve read he’s very close.
Yes, pray for Rush.
Amazing! Rush, who is not a Catholic gets Catholic teaching and clearly states it, and Pelosi, who is an “ardent Catholic” does not!
Krafcliffe, are you a refugee from Moveon.org or Call to Action? Tom
Far less-clever could also take Popelosi apart.
Say what you want about Rush, but at least he is defending the Catholic Faith against a so-called Catholic who publicly lies about it. Who else on the mainstream radio with millions of listeners is calling her to task? Thanks, Rush!
Maybe Rush could bring back the Caller Abortion
How can we hear it outside the US?
Jim,
“How can we hear it outside the US?”
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/today.guest.html
My husband and I pray daily that he converts- it is his only flaw as far as we are concerned. What a coup for the Church in America, and what would the reaction from Her bishops!!!!
“I don’t know what steps publicly the Catholic Church takes in a situation like this. But the first thing that is going to happen is, American Catholics are going to hear about it on this program”
Next, we can all write to Nancy Pelosi’s Bishop:
Most Rev. George H. Niederauer
One Peter Yorke Way
San Francisco, Ca 94109
Does anyone (I’m sure…this may be a rhetorical question) see the delicious
problem here?
1. We have a lapsed/probably indifferent nominally Methodist radio personality
speaking CATHOLIC TRUTH to the lies of the bottom-dwelling slime that infests the
elected offices of government who parade their cultural Catholicism when it suits
their egos/need for election.
2. Not even Pelosi’s bishop (or the rest of the Demoncrat Party at prayer…oops,
the USCCB) has bothered to publicly correct her mistaken falsehoods.
So, now we have to rely on non-Catholics to defend Catholic truth because the people nominally
in control don’t have the manhood to do so?
I guess it’s more important for them to be wined and dined in the corridors of power
than it is to speak truth to evil. Sad. Not disappointed, mind you, just sad for the
decision they apparently have made to trade the ‘honors’ of this world for life with
Him in the next.
Please folks… yes Rush is an entertainer. And yet he has the kahunas to take a segment of his show and discuss religion AND politics. He doesn’t pretend to know that much about the Catholic Church… he will admit that. His problem is with Ms. Pelosi’s obvious spin on this issue for her (and Obama’s) political gain. He is stating something very clearly. EVERYBODY knows what the Catholic Church thinks of the abortion issue. So why is it a mystery to Ms. Pelosi, a so-called “ardent and devout” Catholic. Dittos….
Apparently Archbishop Chaput has answered Pelosi as well. He takes apart piece by piece:
Chaput speaks out: http://www.archden.org/images/ArchbishopCorner/ByTopic/onseparationofsense%26state_openlettercjc8.25.08.pdf
that should be \”…he takes her apart piece by piece.\” Clear and Concise speaking with the voice of orthodoxy.
Minor nitpicky tangent: The radio transcript has a few typos in it. I heard part of the radio broadcast today, and Rush Limbaugh correctly dated Tertullian’s quote to “197 A.D.,” not “179.”
There are a whole lot of influential Catholics out there who could, and should, have been quick to point out how wrong the Speaker of the House is…but it took a non-Catholic to be the first to do so. What does that say about us as American Catholics….the same as it says about most of our Bishops…we want everyone to like us, don’t want to offend anyone, and therefore rather than defending the faith we engage in ppolitical correctness.
While we are on the subject of well known pro abortion Catholics — what about Ed Kennedy who it appears is showing signs of his mortality — If he wishes the last rites and to buried from the Church, will he need to make a public confession condemning abortion and upholding the Churches teaching?
Nancy still looks pretty healthy — she can wait until later…
I am really looking for an answer to this question —
Nick
Don’t hold your breath. He would not be the first Kennedy to have publicly opposed Church teaching and still get a Ctholic funeral complete with a Cardinal or Archbishop or two concelebrating.
Pelosi has the the same problem that everyone who dissents against Catholic moral teachings has. The lot of them worship their personal capacity for sexual pleasure above the God who made them. In a word, rather the commit the act or not, they are “masturbators”. The believe, speak, and ask as if their ultimate personal dignity lies in guarding the right to sex in ANY form EXCEPT the unitive/procreative act that properly belongs ONLY in marriage between a man and a woman. This is Pelosi’s problem pure and simple. She and those like her will not acknowledge what real chaste sex in God’s eyes, which is defined very clear by the Catechism of The Catholic Church:
2339 Chastity includes an apprenticeship in self-mastery which is a training in human freedom. The alternative is clear: either man governs his passions and finds peace, or he lets himself be dominated by them and becomes unhappy.126 “Man’s dignity therefore requires him to act out of conscious and free choice, as moved and drawn in a personal way from within, and not by blind impulses in himself or by mere external constraint. Man gains such dignity when, ridding himself of all slavery to the passions, he presses forward to his goal by freely choosing what is good and, by his diligence and skill, effectively secures for himself the means suited to this end.”127
Contraception and Abortion do not bring happiness. The wreck lives, marriages, create opportunity for sexual immorality, and murder pre-born human persons (i.e. babies).
I heard this live and when the caller first introduced himself as a “former priest and a Jesuit” I thought, “Oh, here we go . . .”
I was pleasantly surprised to hear him speak so solidly regarding Catholic teaching and to defend the popes as being incapable of leading the people into error. What a pity he’s no longer an active priest. Sounds to me like he’s got alot on the ball, and is more solid than many of the Jesuit whack-jobs we’ve all come to know and dislike.
I’m also amazed by liberal types who want to dismiss the likes of Rush as “an entertainer” and not particularly clever. After all he’s independently audited for the accuracy of his opinions and I believe is currently found to be right (correct, accurate) over 98% of the time. Meanwhile, the best the liberal media can do is pony up a tired, ill-mannered (and probably poorly educated) fool like Al Franken or Jon Stewart whose opinions aren’t audited, and are presented in a clearly entertainment-driven format which often gets taken as truth, wisdom or sound reason.
Yawn. Sometimes this stuff just gets boring. Back to reading Newman.
I don’t want to engage in the debate of whether or not Rush Limbaugh is merely an entertainer who generally brings down the level of debate or is an actual intellectual. [You “don’t want to”… uh huh. So you do it anyway. – Fr. Z] I think, judging as Catholics, we can at least say that Rush is frequently lacking in charity and, as intelligent human beings we can say that his criticism of Pelosi for hubris and arrogance rings somewhat hollow. Personally, I don’t have much use for the man. And to the Rush Limbaugh-ites out there, there are many traditionalists and paleo-conservatives who oppose the Limbaughs and Hannitys of the world. Those in opposition are not necessarily MoveOn.org types (as the genius above stated). As far as his brilliance is concerned, did anyone else take a break from drooling over Rush to notice that when Pelosi referred (erroneously) to the teachings of the Doctors of the Church, Rush thought she meant actual medical doctors. Thats not exactly top notch intellectual acumen. However, the important thing here is that Rush took the time to correctly state the facts. For his public defense of the Church’s teaching, he is owed a debt of gratitude and a prayer for his conversion. [I really ought to delete this as an attempt to drag the entry off topic.]
Melchior,
I heard Rush yesterday, and he DID confuse the Doctors of the church with medical doctors. But Rush is deaf and doesn’t “hear” his calls that well, he usually reads a transcript of the caller that he’s talking to.
Rush HAS stood up for the Catholic Church, unfortunately more so than some of our bishops. 4 years ago, when PJPII died, Rush spent quite a bit of time ripping the media over their coverage (and their hope that his successor wouldn’t be so “conservative”)-glad the Cardinals didn’t take the American media’s helpful advice… Rush was clearly moved when Pope Benedict XVI came to the US this spring. It’s wonderful to hear someone taking these politicians to task on their lies. Our bishops would never be able to say it the way Rush does, even if they wanted to.
Melchior Cano said:
“paleo-conservatives”
“as the genius above stated”
“Personally, I don’t have much use for the man”
“Rush is frequently lacking in charity and, as intelligent human beings we can say that his criticism of Pelosi for hubris and arrogance rings somewhat hollow”
WOW! Melchior, Where is YOUR charity, and lack of hubris??
Just a thought.
Semper Fi!
Rush does consistently support a market wage and unlimited economic liberalism, which unfortunately is a very common attitude among Catholics in the U.S. Now, other Catholics in opposition support unlimited Federal regulation, control, and taxation, under the umbrella of equality of outcomes. Of course, neither of these are in accord with Catholic social doctrine, which emphasizes local self-regulation, solidarity, individual virtue, and the universal destination of goods.
American Catholics tend to vote and act like either Freemasons or like Socialists. Now Catholic social doctrine has a lot that would appeal to both conservatives and progressives, and has the additional quality that it is true. The Pelosis and Limbaughs of the world could be quite enlightened by this Church teaching.
Fr.,
You are correct that I did in fact engage in that debate. I apologize for the first section. I was not attempting to drag the conversation off topic, but was merely responding to other comments. Still, it was off-topic and off the intention of my post. I do think that Rush ought to be commended for his actions in defending the perennial teaching of the Church and that his actions certainly merit extra prayers for his conversion to the Faith. Please accept my apologies.
Hey, I just called both the Archbishop’s office and the Speaker’s office…both send you to voice mail.
We need to flood the phonelines folks:
Archbishop Niederauer (415) 614-5500
Speaker of the House (202) 225-0100
Father Z,
You’ve probably answered this, but what are the options for the bishops beyond the written & oral statements? Can she be publicly excommunicated (is this appropriate) for bringing so much scandal to the Church? What is the rule on this issue??
U.S. Bishops DID respond:
http://www.usccb.org
it’s right on the front page
Jennifer,
Come on…what kind of response is this from the USCCB?? It’s written by some lawyer!
So NOW the USCCB has to justify it’s position with a secular angle: “These mistaken biological theories became obsolete over 150 years ago when scientists discovered that a new human individual comes into being from the union of sperm and egg at fertilization.”
Makes me puke their so pussilanimous.
Are we to understand that the defense of Catholic doctrine now must be backed up by science and modernism?
It’s breathtaking that our bishops merely put out press releases on this and don’t take action!!
The assault on our faith comes from all sides, including from within! Until Catholics truly get angry, we’re going to forever have this type of “kumbayaa” response to Satan’s attacks.
The time for talking, blogging, emails, and press releases is over…is there ONE bishop out there that will take action and excommunicate these people?
Pray for our bishops!
Eamon: Relax. The bishops are doing more than they ever have in recent times. Let us be thankful for these small graces, and pray that they continue.
Let us pray for our bishops, who are responding more and more to this obvious attack on Catholicism. The liberal lies are being challenged. Thank God for some good bishops and holy priests, which is my daily prayer….
Eamon–
<> http://www.usccb.org
Looks like a CARDINAL and a BISHOP issued this statement. I have no idea about laywers, but it clearly states that the statement was issued by a CARDINAL and a BISHOP. It’s also a sight more than I had ever hoped for. They DID post something. It was correct and with references for further study. A bit of respect for our Catholic leaders is in order, even if they don’t measure up to your standards!!!
Eamon–
“Cardinal Justin F. Rigali, chairman of the U.S. Bishops’ Committee on Pro-Life Activities, and Bishop William E. Lori, chairman of the U.S. Bishops’ Committee on Doctrine, have issued the following statement:” http://www.usccb.org
Looks like a CARDINAL and a BISHOP issued this statement. I have no idea about laywers, but it clearly states that the statement was issued by a CARDINAL and a BISHOP. It’s also a sight more than I had ever hoped for. They DID post something. It was correct and with references for further study. A bit of respect for our Catholic leaders is in order, even if they don’t measure up to your standards
Oops, sorry about that double post, had a problem–lol, operator error. Is it possible to delete the first of the duplicate posts?