Everyone…. is there available somewhere an 2008 Ordo for the 1962 Missal?
The FSSP used to publish one.
I can’t find one right now.
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An ORDO for 2008????? Could it be, that you rather mean a Calendarium?
I found multiple Liturgical planners/calendars, but not even the SSPX website has an ordo 2008 out yet.
The FSSP Publications Service (www.fssp.com) will have its Ordo 2008 available in mid-November. It probably won’t be listed at their web site until closer to publication, but you can pre-order a copy by phone.
Alight, I’ll ask: how can there be a “2008 Ordo” for the 1962 Missal (or for the 1970 or 2002 for that matter)?
TAN Books and Publishers currently offers a 16-Month Day Planner (encompassing the entirety of 2008) which lists the relevant liturgical days for both the TLM and the Novus Ordo.
It’s just a “cheat sheet” that lists all the feasts with their corresponding Mass readings, Divine Office prayers, liturgical color(s), etc….. It’s a quick reference for priests to mark their missal, breviary, and such.
Le Barroux has its Ordo online, in PDF format. Of course it contains a lot of information that won’t be of immediate use, like Benedictine and diocesean feasts, and days that the abbot pontificates! I think it also tells you what Kyriale they sing every day.
Thomas,
while the Novus Ordo and TLM calendars differ, they both take into account the different dates of Easter and the many holy days and feasts whose date is dependent thereon; feasts that get transferred because they fall on a Sunday or during Holy Week, etc. Plus, each country has its own proper feasts, so the universal calendar gets modified to take account of local feasts.
But the 2008 edition may not yet be up.
It isn’t just a cheat sheet. According to the general rubrics each diocese is to prepare a Calendarium (Ordo), by taking the universal calendar and adding particular feasts, both proper ones (that is ones that are requiredby law, like the Patron saint) and ones conceded by indult. On top of that religious orders and congregations and individual Churches are to also add certain feasts.
For instance if a saint’s body is in the Church, then his feast is celebrated on the day he is in the martyrology and it is 2nd Class, even if he has no feast anywhere else.
So deven with the FSSP Ordo, individual Churches will have to add stuff to it.
Dom Christopher: Links?
Joshua is right!
This Sunday, we at St. Mary\’s in DC celebrated a commemoration for the Propagation of the Faith at the behest of the present hierarchy. I don\’t think we would have known to do that without the FSSP Ordo for 2007. Last Sunday was the \”external Solemnity\” of Our Lady of the Rosary, with commemoration of the Sunday after Pentecost OR the Sunday after Pentecost with commemoration of the external Solemnity of Our Lady of the Rosary.
The mind reels! I\’m sure we wouldn\’t have known those things without the help of the FSSP Ordo.
Fr. Z. Link you requested is not yet up. 2007 Ordo is http://www.barroux.org/docum/ORDO2007.PDF
Links page is http://www.barroux.org/docum/documpres.html
ALL: Remember that we are not talking here about some wall calendar or desk calendar. We need an Ordo. If you are not sure what an Ordo is, you might not be the best person to respond.
We want a PRINTED version of the Ordo, not an online version.
You can ordo one from England: http://www.ordorecitandi.com
For further info: info@ordorecitandi.com
(I happen to know the man that puts the Ordo together each year. If you would like to e-mail him personally, he would be happy to answer your questions. Send me a private e-mail, and I will give you his e-mail address and send a note of introduction, if one is needed.)
As Fr Z said, an Ordo will be necessary. A wall or desk calendar won’t do, especially for those priests and seminarians who are taking up the freedom to use the older breviary.
Regarding the breviary: A number of seminarians are ordering the older form of the breviary, but it has not yet arrived. In the meanwhile, there is some debate whether secular priests using the 1962 breviary are obliged to recite Terce, Sext AND None, or whether they can pick one of the three offices. Answers anyone?
Fr. Z: the Latin Mass Society of England and Wales usually print the Ordo. As far as I can recall, the printed edition usually comes out sometime in November. This is what it looks like. (This is the current Ordo).
Please take note that ordorecitandi.com is prepared for use in connection with the pre-1956 Breviary and Missal (the liturgical books used by sedevacantist groups). It is of little help for the liturgical books in force in 1962.
For any who may still be wondering exactly what an ordo for a given year is. … It contains principally a mult-page table with one line for each of the 365 or 366 days of that calendar year. Typically, as in the FSSP ordo for 2007 in front of me now, that line gives the following pieces of information about the day in question:
Day — what day of the Church calendar is to be celebrated
Class — 1, 2, 3, 4 (Major feasts like the upcoming Christ the King are 1st class, most Sundays after Pentecost are 2nd class, most typical saints’ days are 3rd class, and ferias without a saint are 4th class.)
Color — white, green, red, violet, or black vestments
Gloria & Credo — whether or not either or both are to be recited or sung that day
Preface — which Preface is to be used that day
Commemoration — whether another feast is to be commemorated with second collect, secret, postcommunion, etc.
Vespers — Which Vespers to be used for the day
It’s especially interesting in case of a possible ambiguity, and a choice must be made. For instance, as Jeff alluded for Sunday, October 7, 2007 — on which both the 19th Sunday of Pentecost and the Feast of Our Lady of the Rosary fell this year — the table contains two lines, because both are 2nd class feasts neither of which automatically takes precedence over the other. One line is for the 19th Sunday of Pentecost and specifies green vestments and the Preface of the Holy Trinity. The other line is for Our Lady of the Rosary (as an “external solemnity” instead of the Sunday Mass) and specifies white vestments and the Preface of the BVM. So Mass that day could be celebrated following either line.
As another example, the line for this coming Monday, October 29, 2007 — which is a 4th class feria — indicates the Mass of the (2nd class) 22nd Sunday after Pentecost is to be celebrated, since it will have been superceded on Sunday, October 28 by the 1st class Feast of Christ the King.
The Saint Lawrence Press Latin Ordo for 2008 will be available for sale from the end of next week £10 or $15
Info will be posted on the website next week on postal charges etc.
Director: Are we correct in our understanding that the Saint Lawrence Press Latin Ordo is NOT in fact for the calendar and rubrics for the 1962 Missale? Instead, it is for an earlier version? The pre-1956 Breviary and Missal?
Not having an Ordo is a hassle. I have been using a 1954 Missal, the England and Wales Ordo, the Baronius Press Handmissal (for American feasts and feast for our archdiocese), then I have to reference the 1962 rubrics, and be on the lookout for particluar things (like OLA being dedicated on Septt. 2, therefore 1st Class feast and whether or no our little chapel gets a special feast, because it is only temporary, and things like that)
I will be happy when I can get an FSSP Ordo, and have only to worry about very local peculiarities.
Henry Edwards,
Just an FYI. You wrote “It’s especially interesting in case of a possible ambiguity, and a choice must be made. For instance, as Jeff alluded for Sunday, October 7, 2007—on which both the 19th Sunday of Pentecost and the Feast of Our Lady of the Rosary fell this year—the table contains two lines, because both are 2nd class feasts neither of which automatically takes precedence over the other. ”
In fact, one does automatically take precedence over the other. A Second Class Sunday supersedes a Second Class Feast, except for a Second Class Feast of Our Lord. This is clearly listed in the Table of Occurrence (found at the beginning of the Missal and Breviary).Hence, the Ordo speaks of a permission to observe the External Solemnity of the Rosary. If neither Sunday nor Feast took precedence or the Feast took precedence, there would be no need to speak of nor make use of an External Solemnity.
John
Father, you can obtain a copy of the 2008 Ordo from the Society of St. Pius X, throught their publishing arm called the Angelus Press. Give it a try.
William A. Torchia, Esquire
William: Link?
The FSSP ordo is not yet available. But the link to it on the FSSP publications site is: http://store.fraternitypublications.com/20lior.html
And if you like to get the FSSP 2008 Ordo ASAP (mid November) you can go to http://www.fssp.com and dial the telephone contact number you find there, then extension 401, and place a pre-order.
Henry: Thanks for that concrete information. I just got off the phone with them.
Yes, it is good to get a copy of the 2008 Ordo ASAP so that folks can plan ahead. My hesitation about the Previous calendar is the fact there are myriad more saints/feasts since 1962. For instance there is a Saint Maximilian Kolbe, a Blessed Theresa of Calcutta, not to mention Bls Jacinta and Francisco Marto of Fatima. I wouldn’t like any of their feasts being omitted when the very Mass which sustained them was the Extraordinary Tridentine Mass.
Father Z wrote, “We want a PRINTED version of the Ordo, not an online version.”
—Dear Father, strictly speaking, an online version can be printed. ;-)
There was an excellent universal ordo (like the Vatican would put out) on the http://www.ecclesiacatholica.com/ site (from another in Rome- http://www.ecclesiacatholica.com/).
I’ve been also waiting on the 2008 (which I hope they will bring out).