Episcopalians can be a rich treasure trove of self-parody.
They just keep pushing those cusp issues so that they can stay in the news… thus, confirming their existence.
I was sent this story:
INDIANAPOLIS, IN: Bishops go Transgender at GC2012
By David W. Virtue in Indianapolis
www.virtueonline.orgThe Episcopal Church is on the brink of modifying its stand on human sexuality that will make it the first denomination in history to publicly recognize a small group of men and women who have had a sex change operation as eligible for ordained ministry. [Hang on… if you are a male, they can ordain you and if you are female, they can ordain you. Soooo… if you are a male who defines himself as female… what difference does it make?]
An array of liberal and revisionist Episcopal bishops spoke up on Resolution D002 arguing that no person shall be denied access to the discernment process for any ministry, lay or ordained, in this Church because of race, color, ethnic origin, national origin, sex, marital status, sexual orientation, gender identity and expression, disabilities or age, except as otherwise provided by these Canons. No right to licensing, ordination, or election is hereby established. [Could this really be a move away fro speciesism?]
Only two orthodox bishops, Mark Lawrence of South Carolina and Bill Love of Albany expressed any disapproval.
Speaking against the resolution, Lawrence said the [church] had entered into a time of “individualized Eros.” [Imagine the stunning level of theological discourse they must have had in this meeting.]
[…]
[Get this!] Mark Andrus, Bishop of California, told Bishop Waldo that the confusion is why it should be approved. The resolution passed. [LOL!]
Don’t you wish there were videos of all this on YouTube?
This is way beyond the hermeneutic of rupture and well into the hermeneutic of “make-it-up-as-you-go”.
Mark Andrus, Bishop of California, told Bishop Waldo that the confusion is why it should be approved. The resolution passed.
Didn’t Archbishop Nancy Pelosi of the American Patriotic Catholic Church say something similar about Pope Barack’s (The First Gay President’s) Obamacare? “We need to pass it so we can understand what’s in it!”
I hope the LCWR invites Presiding Bishop Jefferts Schori to address their annual assembly on the subject of the right of the transgendered to priestly ordination.
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“An array of liberal and revisionist Episcopal bishops spoke up on Resolution D002 arguing that no person shall be denied access to the discernment process for any ministry, lay or ordained, in this Church because of race, color, ethnic origin, national origin, sex, marital status, sexual orientation, gender identity and expression, disabilities or age…”
They left out “creed”!
[Funny. That’s the spirit! However, by leaving “creed” out, they must think belief is in some way still important. Perhaps they’ll add that next time!]
Reason number (it must be in the millions by now) for A.C.?
I can see lifting the restrictions next to allow domesticated animal companions as deacons.
But Father, shouldn’t these inclusivity loving Episcopalians try to be somewhat less anthropocentric in their forward-thinking? What if our four-legged brothers and sisters are experiencing a call to the ordained ministry? Perhaps PETA needs to look into this issue?
A commenter on an Anglican site made a really keen observation: the gay crowd claims that ” ‘God doesn’t make mistakes’, therefore, if I’m gay, it’s because God made me that way on purpose, and everyone should celebrate that”. On the other hand, the transvestite/transsexual (whatever) crowd says “God made a mistake. I’m supposed to be a girl and He made me a boy!!”. So which is it? If we affirm “gays” aren’t we invalidating transsexuals? Hmmmm, what to do, what to do?
“Episcopalians can be a rich treasure trove of self-parody.”
Well, I though “self-…” but not “parody.”
The ECUSA is well beyond any Rubicon of restraint or standards where ordination is concerned. Oh, except age. Most dioceses won’t ordain you if you are over 42 or so.
And to think, a number of years ago when my priest told me that his roommate in seminary had been abused by his father and therefore would not refer to God as “Father”, I asked, “Isn’t that an impediment to being a priest?” Oh, so naive.
Once again proving Johnson’s First Law of Anglican Thermodynamics — you cannot joke about whatever monstrosity the Episcopalians are going to be up to next, because they will beat you to it.
Remember that they have already had pets receiving communion . . . can ordination be far behind?
(I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again — I am so blessed to be sitting up on the hillside watching the monstrous train wreck of the Episcopal Church, instead of screaming inside one of the flaming, telescoping Pullman cars . . . . )
AnAmericanMom said: “I am so blessed to be sitting up on the hillside watching the monstrous train wreck of the Episcopal Church, instead of screaming inside one of the flaming, telescoping Pullman cars . . ”
You and me both, sister. Today, I received the wonderful, happy news that a dear relative still languishing in the TEO will be seeking reception in the Church through the Anglican Ordinariate. Praise the Lord, and thank you BVM for prayers heard and answered!!
If sexual orientations aren’t a hindrance anymore, I can’t wait until they ordain the first openly proud pedophile!
Sissy also brings up an awesome point!
Gays say God made them that way because he makes no mistakes. Transsexuals claim God makes mistakes hence they must change, who therefore is mistaken? If gays try to argue that “alright God makes mistakes, hence why transexuals can change because it’s His divine plan for them to face this challenge , then could it not be argued that God made people gay by mistake and its His divine plan that they overcome it? Ha ha! It’s all so comical! But these are the same people saying ‘confusion is a good thing!’ so I doubt it’ll matter. Logic isn’t dictated anymore… God is no longer logic or love, just feel good feely mcfeelings…
“Mark Andrus, Bishop of California, told Bishop Waldo that the confusion is why it should be approved. The resolution passed.”
The funny thing about stuff like this is that these pretend clerics actually say such stupid things with as much pseudo-reverence and feigned-authority as they can muster. They actually think that kind of garbage is “profound”.
Johnno,
It has already happened. The news media just has a blackout on it.
The sad part is that there are people who will want to discuss this seriously. I can’t respect orgainsations that would debate the merits of letting these poor people be priests and pretend that paying a lot of money to have their bodies mutilated is not proof of serious mental illness. Why does someone have to prove their love for me by granting me sex? Can’t a man have a best friend to love without sex? This is so lame it is beneath contempt.
Now, I did wake up one day to discover I had become a cockroach….
“Mark Andrus, Bishop of California, told Bishop Waldo that the confusion is why it should be approved. The resolution passed.”
No wonder they like interpretive ‘modern art.’ It’s all very modern! Vatican II apparently tried to be modern too, hoping to catch in on the trends I guess… I guess they figure the more open to interpretation something is, the more appealing it will be to a broader spectrum of people who’ll just see in it whatever they want to and therefore will sign up… Kind of like all the very modern day interpretations of Jesus… There’s one for everyone. It’ll just never end…
It’s interesting t note that when studying other religions, the closer you get to the original sources and older religions that have long since died out, the closer you actually get to something very much in common with Judeo/Christianity. Looking at the ancient now extinct Chinese religion a and language, you find sacrifice, monotheism, and allusions to the historical accounts of Genesis, the Flood and a man named Nuah who escaped it with his family on a boat. Look at the old Aborigine and Native American legends and you end up with the Genesis accounts again in variant forms. The same for other Middle Eastern accounts such as the epic Gilgamesh. Look into Hinduism, and the Vedas written in the oldest Sanskrit, and you find monotheism, prayers to the ‘Holy Spirit’, the most amazing anti-abortion prayers you’ll ever find condemning it far worse than any Church document has ever dared to describe. You again find Genesis, the first man, Adaman, prophecies of the One who will come, the light, the truth, whom all men will despise and kill by tying him to a tree, to whom we must set aside all others and follow. It’s startling!
The explanation for this phenomena is simply that, once upon a time all men shared the same revelation of God. They moved away from each other. In time, the revelation of God was corrupted. The original Religion would be further distorted by schism, separation, liberality, accepted heresy, and the modernism of its eras. This is the same pattern the Church followed, from its inception to the Protestant revolt and other schisms, to the modernism that infects us and leads to a variety of distorted view that mirror paganism and polytheism. It is happening all over again. We are seeing Christianity follow the same path as the original revelation shared by men when they were commonly united.
Your first steps to successful proper ecumenism is to point out that the Catholic Faith is a call back to other religions to return back to the roots of the original faith they descended from. The Catholic Faith is a fulfillment of their ancestral faiths’ hopes for deliverance and to come in union with the true God. The Catholic faith fixes the errors they embarked upon. The current Christian landscape and what the Episcopalians are doing is a demonstration of the sabotage man is capable of committing against the revelation he was originally given. This is why other religions must study the Catholic Faith and see that the most ancient original forms of their own faiths were indicating its very arrival, and its fulfillment of their hopes.
It is, unfortunately, their own version of trans-substantiation (with a totally different meaning) and on current form, as close as they’ll ever get……
Fr. Z and Baeda Benedictus: They will have to take up “creed” next time, because they are all ready changing the canons to allow non-baptized persons to participate in communion. So, it’s just a logical step that the non-baptized and even non-Christians will be ordained next. And why not? The “presiding bishop”, Ms. Jefferts-Schori is herself a Universalist-Unitarian (and oceanographer; let’s not forget she’s an oceanographer).
Johnno, AnAmericanMom is right. Ms. Jefferts-Schori knowingly ordained a confessed pedophile. She then permitted him to be assigned to a job leading a children’s choir. Although she denied this in an open letter to the TEO members, she admitted it under oath in a deposition in the inevitable lawsuit. Such nice people.
St. Thomas writes that if one is confused or depressed one should not make a decision. OOPS. I forgot they do not know who he is….
So if one cannot be excluded from ordination because of race, gender, gender confusion, etc.” can one be ordained if one is dead? Maybe they will ordain the first zombie priest!
I think of Caligula making his favorite horse a senator….
One of the reasons (one of many, mind you) that I left the Episcopal
Churchsocial thingy was that, as an Anglican blogger, satire had become impossible, No stretch of a warped imagination – with or without chemical enhancement – could even come close to reality. My parodies were obsolete before I even finished typing. It’s like listening to the confessions of a long-time serial killer. First it’s shocking; then it’s just terribly sad; ultimately it’s just banal.Last night, the first openly gay bishop, Vicki Gene Robinson, presided over what they call a “eucharist” for gays and transgendered; this is an actual prayer from that ceremony: “Spirit of Life, we thank you for disordering our boundaries and releasing our desires as we prepare this feast of delight”.
I’m sure there is a spirit that disorders boundaries, but I don’t think that spirit has anything to do with light.
Gosh, we should start a “recovered Anglicans society”.
Sissy, that’s pretty awful. I think it may be worse than the Episcopalian husband and wife, priest & priestess, who were leading a double life as a Wiccan priest and priestess.
I think he eventually resigned, then took it back . . . not sure what happened after that. I don’t need to care anymore (thank heavens!)
Origen must be spinning in his grave.
@ AnAmericanMother
They did???
Oh wow!
I need a drink…
I need to escape reality for a moment… I think I’ll go watch Spiderman…
What is sad is that in this train wreck there are many victims, I’m thinking of the faithful Episcopalians I met over the years who were very orthodox in outlook and worship. For example one religious community I was associated with, the Community of St. Mary now located in Greenwich NY, a group of Episcopal nuns living and worshiping faithfully in the Benedictine tradition, that would put many of the Catholic LCWR types to shame. I pray that they may take advantage of Anglicanorum Coetibus and come over to the One True Church as soon as possible.
I agree, JonPatrick; there is a group of faithful former episcopalian nuns near Baltimore who have already converted. But, episcopalians have had a great deal of warning on this. It was perfectly clear back in 2003 which way the wind was blowing (some would say when ordination of women began). I think there will continue to be a slow trickle of faithful Christians heading for the exits. But I also know quite a few lovely episcopalians (some in my own family) who are very attached to their local parish, especially the social aspects. I can’t tell you how many sweet, old ladies I’ve heard say things like “They aren’t going to chase me out of MY church” or “I was christened here, I was married here, my children were christened here, and I’m going to be buried here.” Folks who think this way have lost the plot, and they will probably stick it out until they see an actual transvestite up behind the altar. Given the way numbers are falling, the episcopal social club will be extinct in another 20 years or so, and that’s a good thing. A few will come home to Mother Church (one of my relatives made that decision just yesterday). Most of the faithful Christians left in TEO will wander off to fly-by-night Anglican assemblies or non-denominational fellowships (as I did for a while before seeing the light).
Wow-what a train wreck the Episcopalians have become.
Next up to the plate are the Anglicans, who have put off the vote on bishopesses until November.
Thank God for Anglianorum Coetibus!
And I’m glad that you, AnAmericanMother, and you, Sissy, have ‘Crossed the Tiber’ and ‘Come Home’ to Holy Mother Church!
@bbmoe,
You wrote:
In fact, starting several decades ago (at least by the 1980s), they would generally not accept into an ordination discernment program anyone shy of about 35 years of age. They wanted all of their candidates for ordination to “have significant life experience” prior to beginning seminary. Having been in The Episcopal Church™ from 1970 until 2008, when I departed —formally and officially in writing (redacted letter of resignation here)and enrolled in RCIA at the Dominican Parish in Seattle’s University District—I can speak with some authority on the subject. Particularly as I was on the Discernment Committee for a candidate in the 1980s while stationed in the southern outskirts of our nation’s capitol.
Incidental to some of the comments in reply to my letter linked above, my wife followed me into RCIA some few months after I left, and we were received together into the Church at Pentecost 2010, and our marriage of now almost 32 years was convalidated in the context of the Noon Mass on June 17th just past at our Dominican Parish, there having been the issue of my prior marriage and divorce.
Pax et bonum,
Keith Töpfer
@Sissy,
Just an aside, there is nothing inherently wrong with being an oceanographer. I served the last 14 years 4 months of my 241-month active duty Naval service as a Naval Oceanographer, the Restricted Line Officer community responsible for:
The problem with Jefferts-Schori (aside from her publicly paraded intellectual, moral and ethical deficiencies) is that she was purely a research oceanographer. She has none of the requisite experience which would have equipped her to be a leader, ecclesiastical or otherwise, or to preside over a deliberative body (clerical or otherwise). She may have done very well in studying and describing cephalopod molluscs in scientific research papers (I am not qualified to speak to that discipline), but as the leader of a Christian denomination she is a walking, talking and breathing disaster.
Pax et bonum,
Keith Töpfer
Martial Artist: of course oceanography is a great field….both my daughter and son-in-law specialized in that area. It’s just not the usual academic training one expects in the head of a supposedly-major Christian denomination. Sorry to offend; it’s rather an inside joke among some disaffected Anglicans to note that Jeffert-Schori has a doctorate but NOT in theology. Sorry if the joke fell flat.