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HERE
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Fr. Z is officially a hybrid of Gandalf and Obi-Wan XD
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Rev. John Zuhlsdorf, a scrappy blogger popular with the Catholic right.
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RC integralist who prays like an evangelical fundamentalist.
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[T]he even more mainline Catholic Fr. Z. blog.
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Deus Ex Machina
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Reader comment.
"Fr. Z disgraces his priesthood as a grifter, a liar, and a bully. -
- Mark Shea
Thus, I was amused by a note from a reader letting me know about a new edition of The Hobbit in Latin. Hobbitus Ille. (I don’t think the “Ille” was needed, but… )
I also want to draw your attention to a booklet from the Catholic Truth Society about J.R.R. Tolkien, newly published I think.
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Very cool, Fr. Z! Our homeschooled son has ventured into The Hobbit just in the last couple of weeks. He is savoring it. And he is doing very well in Latin, thanks in large part to the encouragement of your blog. This weekend he is attending a LOTR all day party with some of his pals. This book would make a great Christmas present!
I already got mine!
Cavete, omnes vos lecturos/as. Not to live up to my name too much, but my own very cursory glances at the text at Amazon, combined with the two critical reviews there, give me a plenteous amount of pause. The Latinity of the book seems quite questionable. From what I can tell, the author knows Latin well enough, but I fear the publisher may have rushed this out of the box to get the marketing benefit of the movie. I would be happy to be proven wrong, but so far I’ve seen nothing but indications that this will need some major revision. Perhaps I’m in the minority: what do ye think, all y’all who have studied/spoken/written/taught Latin? Am I correct on this one?
The movie opened up today in New Zealand. Two more will be coming out, in the next two years.
Yet another reason to be excited about learning Latin (next semester in worst case scenario, next year in best case)!
Pedantic Classicist, be even more pedantic and say, Cavete, omnes vos lecturi/ae.
Even More Pedantic Myself
Minnesotan,
Well, I’ll use the usual excuse when a typo somehow makes its way onto one of my exams: I must have changed the construction at the last second! ;)
Well, ok, THAT’S a heck of a time to make a stupid mistake. Anyway, am I right about the book?
I have it from reliable sources that the Latin is pretty bad. That said, it could still be useful for beginners who aren’t able to tell good Latin from bad.
Although the page on Amazon indicates I am checking the bilingual kindle edition, looking inside shows only Latin content. A big FAIL for Amazon. I would not for an instant consider the purchase without being able to see how it is presented.
“beginners who aren’t able to tell good Latin from bad.”
That would be me, only two (university) years of latin, third one starting. Don’t see the need for the Ille in Hobbitus Ille, that’s about it…. so, I can’t offer any intelligent commentary on the text, sorry.
I have ordered the book (but Fr. Z didn’t provide an Amazon.de link, so I couldn’t give him a commission :( ). I imagine that I will be upset about some constructions, but the same happened in Harrius Potter. I mean, “ex aere tenui”? I sincerely doubt that one would be seen in classical Latin.
The Ancient Greek Harry Potter is quite difficult, by the way. I am able to read it, but I have to work at it. Harry Potter Latin reads easily directly from the page, and I susupect this will be similar.
I suspect that the “Ille” in the title is echoing the classic “Winnie Ille Pu”. Of course, there is more reason for the ille in that case, because the first story has Christopher Robin explaining why there’s a “the” in the name…
Yes, I was thinking Winnie Ille Pu probably had inspired the choice. Love Winnie Ille Pu!
I saw this a while back here.>>> http://www.lotrplaza.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=242593
I don’t know exactly what these people think, but I know that some of these people are somewhat knowledgeable Tolkien scholars….e.g. Hammond and Scull… :)
It seems they’re afraid it will be a dopey translation.
Doesn’t “ille” in this case mean more like “that very one”? As in, not just “the (unstressed) hobbit” but “THE (that very one) hobbit”? Vague memories from three years of Latin …
Ardologically speaking, is this a ‘Vetus’ translation from Findegil’s copy of the Thain’s Book copy of the Red Book of Westmarch – apparently Professor Tolkien’s primary witness – which he may have consulted in producing his own magisterial English translation, or some amusing but unauthoratative modern Latin ‘retro’ version from his English? If the former, then Pedantic Classicist and David Arsenault, together with the rest of us, may welcome its ‘bad Latin’ as valuable evidence to the earlier reception history – especailly as we patiently await the scholarly edition of the Westron text!
This quote from Boswell’s Life of Johnson expresses my feelings on the matter, related to the quality of the Latin:
I and a few of my classmates have decided to get together for fun and translate it back to English! (Can’t wait!!) :)