First, those who promote ordination of women as deacons (aka deaconettes) claim that they are only interested in diaconate for women, not priesthood. While your planet’s yellow sun doesn’t give me mind reading powers, I think that’s not true. No matter what they say in public, I don’t believe for an instant that they are not really aiming at priesthood. Enough.
Second, when wymyn have fake ordinations, simulating a sacrament, against the Church’s laws and teachings, they sin and commit scandal. There are consequences for those who participate, including excommunication. That’s for the Catholics. But these fake ceremonies are usually held in Protestant churches. Are there consequences for them? There ought to be.
I saw this from the liberal RNS:
NORTHBROOK, Ill. – Her whole life, Susan Vaickauski felt an internal struggle.
But earlier this summer, as Vaickauski lay prostrate at the foot of the altar of a church in the Chicago suburbs, while friends, family and supporters sang the litany of the saints over her, that struggle disappeared.
In its place, she said, she felt “this overwhelming sense of peace and just God saying, ‘Yes, this is exactly what I was asking of you. This is where I want you to be. This is what I want you to do.’ It’s this feeling of knowing you did what’s being asked of you.” [I suspect that whatever “voice” that was, it was not God speaking.]
What she felt God asking her to do – what she always has felt God calling her to do, she said – was to become a Catholic priest, a vocation that has been barred to women. [She is still not a Catholic priest.]
She answered that call on Saturday, June 11, when she was [not] ordained to the priesthood by Roman Catholic Womenpriests, an international movement to prepare, [pretend to] ordain and support female priests.
Vaickauski’s [fantasy] ceremony was held at a Protestant church, as the Roman Catholic Church officially does not recognize these ordinations. [The Church does not recognize them in any way, including “officially”. NB: When you see language like this, this “official” category, alarms should ring. The Fishwrap does this often: they juxtapose the “official” Church with the church of the spirit… or something. They seem to place the notions of masses of people over and against the Church’s ordained pastors, the Magisterium.][…]
Since she was ordained earlier this summer, Vaickauski has [not] celebrated Catholic Mass for a small worshiping community of 20 to 50 people once a month at Northbrook United Methodist Church, where she was [not] ordained. She’s been asked to offer spiritual direction and funerals. [It just gets worse.]
First, pray for this confused woman. She is in grave spiritual peril and she is committing terrible scandal.
Next, what about this business of these wymyn conducting these fake ordinations at Protestant churches? The consequence for Catholic in these simulated ordinations are clear. I contend that there ought to be consequences for the Protestants.
What could those consequences be?
Here is something that I have written in the past.
Antics like this should have consequences for ecumenical dialogue.
The women’s ordination thing is silliness. It is a circus.
A Protestant church hosted the circus. They gave the Catholic Church the finger.
There should be consequences.
We either take ecumenism seriously or we don’t. If we do – and I believe we must – we have to react strongly when ecumenical ideals are so grossly violated by Protestants who invite or permit these “women priest” ceremonies in their churches.
The most sacred rites of the Catholic Church are Holy Mass and ordination to Holy Orders.
They effectively trampled rites that we Catholics hold as sacred.
These silly Catholic women-priest supporters are committing sacrilege in simulating Mass and Orders.
However, the Protestants who host them are assisting in a mockery of our Holy Mass and a mockery of our priesthood.
For a long time progressivist Catholics were staging Jewish sedar meals in their churches. Some Jews were angered by this. We got the message from the Jews and stopped doing what was offensive to them.
By allowing this group of fakers into their churches, those Protestants accepted the premise that what those women play at is actually a Catholic ordination and a Mass.
How dare PROTESTANTS decide what a Catholic Mass is?
And if they respond, “Gee, we mean no disrespect. We are just giving space to this group”, then what they are doing is aiding a protest against the Catholic Church. In the case cited at the top of this entry, the staff of that Methodist church are clearly more than just giving space: they are going to employ this faker.
There is no way around this.
Protestants who give these fakers aid are either on their side, and thus support their claim that what they are doing really is an ordination and Mass, or in claiming not to be taking sides they are still giving support to an anti-Catholic protest.
Bishops have to take action when offensive, anti-Catholic things like this take place.
Upon hearing the news that this ceremony is going to take place (or has taken place), the local Catholic bishop must call the pastor of that Protestant parish and say,
“I’m the Catholic Bishop. Do not allow this sacrilege to be committed in your church. You wouldn’t do this for a group of dissident Jews wanting to ordain rabbis, but we are Catholics so you don’t care what offense you give us. Until an apology is issued, don’t look for us to dialogue with you again.”
Then that Catholic bishop should call the head of the denomination and convey the same message.
Then that Catholic Bishop should send an informative note to the USCCB’s ecumenical office and to the CDF and to the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity to let them know the facts of the sacrileges that took place and who helped them.
Then that Catholic bishop should call the press and give them his view about the offense the Protestants gave and the damage they inflicted on ecumenical dialogue.
True ecumenism does not consist in lying down and letting some other church kick you and define what Mass is for you, or say who can be ordained, or stick their “F-You” finger in your face by hosting these sacrilegious fakers.
Susan Vaickauski, center right, celebrates Communion alongside Presiding Bishop Joan Clark Houk, center left, of the Great Waters Region of Roman Catholic Womanpriests at her [fake] ordination to the priesthood on June 11, 2016, at the Northbrook United Methodist Church in Northbrook, Illinois. RNS photo by Emily McFarlan Miller
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Dear Father, in the name of ecumenism, during my lifetime, the Church has been bending over backwards not to “offend” Protestants. The liturgy has been dumbed down, Latin abandoned, basic teachings on morals ignored, the Popes have even abandoned time-hallowed rituals. I had an Anglican clergymen happily tell me there was no reason I couldn’t attend his services because the forms were so similar now. And where has it got us? Has any Protestant church moved ONE INCH towards Catholicism in any way? Somebody tell me, I’d really like to know, because it seems to me we have done all the accommodating.
Amen! I am sick of the double talk: having women deacons doesn’t mean that we’ll want women priests; calling for inclusion and acceptance doesn’t mean that we want Church teaching on homosexuality to change; allowing gays to marry is all we want and we won’t force anyone to accept or approve of that if it becomes legal. I call BS to it all. And the worst part of it is when I hear these things coming from our own Catholic shepherds.
I see no male saints are allowed.
One of the things that struck me in the photo was the (women) saints on the “banners” behind the faux celebration. Catherine of Sienna, Teresa of Avila, Teresa of Lisieux, Hildegard von Bingen. Have these women actually studied what these saints wrote and taught? I can somewhat understand von Bingen. She was a visionary and many of these women delude themselves as the same.
However, Catherine of Sienna? Teresa of Avila? If they were truly present, we would likely see a repeat of St. Nicholas’ interaction with Arius. They certainly would not have entertained this nonsense.
One of the women on the right seems to be wearing a head covering…along with her pants. Maybe she’s a server?
Hmm. The wymyn (wannabe) priests should start a trend and wear pants-albs!
And thus I quote from the notes to changes from DSM-IV to V:
Delusional Disorder
Criterion A for delusional disorder no longer has the requirement that the delusions must be nonbizarre. A specifier for bizarre type delusions provides continuity with DSM-IV. The demarcation of delusional disorder from psychotic variants of obsessive-compulsive disorder and body dysmorphic disorder is explicitly noted with a new exclusion criterion, which states that the symptoms must not be better explained by conditions such as obsessive-compulsive or body dysmorphic disorder with absent insight/delusional beliefs. DSM-5 no longer separates delusional disorder from shared delusional disorder. If criteria are met for delusional disorder then that diagnosis is made.
I know that criticism of the DSM-V centres upon it making everyone sick. But given the sacrilegious events and plain rampant sin in our world, especially within the Church, to my mind its entirely possible we are sinning ourselves to mental ill health.
How odd… I lived a block from Northbrook United Methodist Church for almost a decade before moving to the south three years ago. I’m sure His Excellency, Archbishop Cupich, is sorry that he couldn’t attend.
Imagine if some dissident Muslim group tried to do something analogous to this.
Imagine the reaction from outraged Islamists.
Imagine the consequences that would be visited on whatever organisation that was bold (or foolish) enough to host said analogous event.
And then, imagine the lengths to which the liberal media would go in attempting to defend and justify the reaction of said Islamists.
What loons. They’re just nutz.
This is yet another illustration of the futility of ecumenical activity with the Protestant ecclesial communities. They don’t really respect us. Look East people! We have much more in common with the Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox and Assyrian Churches. Let’s concentrate our efforts for unity there and forget the Protestants.
And I say that as yet another former Protestant (Lutheran-now Byzantine Catholic).
Where are the hords of dissenting women permanent deacons? If that is what the contingent is arguing for, I would expect dissenting groups of permanent women deaconettes to exist. I mean if God is calling these women to the diaconat(t?)e specifically as an end point, where are the few percent of them that are crazy enough to simulate ordination to the permanent diaconat(t?)e in some Episcopalian building?
Is there a single dissenting permanent deaconette? Can you please stand up?
“It’s this feeling” …no,it’s not.
They’re not Roman Catholic. End of story, no matter what they call themselves.
There’s a local nub of American Catholics here in town that have a very snide website telling everyone they’re the anodyne to the Roman Catholic Church with its horrible exclusionary, triggering, and mean meanie ways. Their married ‘priest’ offers marriage and other sacraments to ALL, regardless of disposition toward sin or same-sex or what have you. They also celebrate the ‘eucharist’ in a converted bungalow and have an ecumenical prayer labyrinth in the backyard. I guess we don’t get to yell at heretics any more, as that’s bad form, but that’s what this nonsense is.
Anyway, my response to them is a resounding: whatever. I can paint the word DOG on a cat and teach it to bark, but it’s still quite a cat, in the end.
Luther’s legacy lives on…. I agree, there should be consequences. And they aren’t able to recreate a proper felt banner. ;D
Outrageous.
Tragically, these people and their followers feel entitled. On top of confusing their personal ambition with a true, God-given vocation.
Deacon Kandra of Aleteia wrote a very good column on this subject recently.
When these women and their misguided sympathizers are given a platform, there is never any mention of service to the Church or surrender to God’s will. It is always what they “feel” and what they “have always wanted”, etc. And then there is always a condescending speech about how the Church is male-led and male-centered, and those who are faithful are somehow ignorant and superstitious.
And, as you have pointed out, the media always says they are not “officially” recognized as priests by the Catholic Church, but they still refer to these women in their make-believe world as “Catholic” and their services as “Mass”.
Does no one ever wonder why, if they are truly Catholic, that they are not welcome to function in a real Catholic church?
I cannot understand why anyone would put their immortal soul at risk for this fantasy.
Yes it is sacrilege and the bishop should make a strong public statement against it, something along the line of an anathema. Unfortunately in some parts of the country (wacky northeast) a good number of the bishops priests and their flocks are probably in the audience cheering those wymyn-not-a-priests on.
The audience for this charade contains not one person without gray hair. I often wonder if these are people who retired too early or simply have too much time on their hands. Thus in their sloth, they proceed to pick up evil as their new occupation.
Perhaps the local Catholic parish could fight fire with fire? For example, host a dissident group of Methodists who blatantly disregard UMC doctrine *before* the next General Conference throws it out.
I see some bald heads.
Now unless Sinead O’Connor was in attendance, it tells me there were girly men there. Whether they were Catholic girly men or just girly men in general remains a mystery.
I also note they are not saying the ‘not-a-mass’ in the Extraordinary Form or even ad orientem. surprised?
This is feminism. Radical, 1970s style, Betty Freidan, Gloria Steinam, man-hating feminism. It is NOT being “called by the Holy Spirit.” It is not “out of love for the Church.” These feminists are worshipping at the alter of some feminist she-goddess. It’s time to stop dialoging with these anti-Catholic heretics and those who enable them. It is time to call them out, ex-communicate them, send them their bells, books and candles even if it means martyrdom by the state and/or the state-run church and that’s where we’re going I’m afraid.
The quality of the giant puppets is much better!
I’d be hopeful except for the part about “bishops must take action”.
I don’t want to sound like I am struggling with my faith in a happy ending….but are we really expecting Bishop Cupich to admonish anyone other than orthodox Catholics? I mean come on, this lady probably followed her conscience and we all know that trumps EVERYTHING. ahh the lovely windy city. one can either get brutally murdered or inundated in heresy. i am impressed with the amount of faithful Catholics that still are making it. I am praying for you each and every day.
If there are any Scriptural following, Apostle led Methodists left, I’m certain the Ordinariate is meant for you. Please consider joining a real Church, instead of a political organization masquerading itself as one, while avoiding taxes.
boxerpaws63: That’s just it. You can’t argue “feelings”. She may indeed have had that feeling.
Arguing about THAT is a waste of time.
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This is just goofy. What a waste of time and energy on their part.
All else aside…
… Why are they all holding hands???
I think time will provide us with a solution.
Gee . . . that’s weird. Compare that to St. (Mother) Theresa’s experiences:
Fr Z. said :
I agree . Hang ’em from their eyelids until they blink..
Seriously though, these misguided ‘catholic’ people are to be pitied and to be prayed for. [Which I believe I recommended, above.] If they even had an inkling of what the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass really is, they would never dare to pretend they had any authority to play priest. I wonder if their offence would be recognized under Canon 1378 ? [There is no doubt that they are simulating sacraments.]
ncstevem, hairlessness can also mean cancer.
My 3rd and 5th Grade teachers, Sr. Joanna and Sr. Boniface, had they been at that “ceremony” … there would have been pointers and golden rulers flying faster than a buzz saw through warm butter.
As I read this I’m reminded that the Roman Catholic Church (and all Catholics) lead, we don’t follow Protestantism (or anyone or thing) down the dark, dank path to who knows where.
Protestants have been giving the Catholic Church the finger for a long time. I find in this act nothing new. We turn to them and smile & wave. Heap coals, right?
Consequences? Sure. Excommunicate them very publicly and then speak of them no more. Have their Bishop write them a letter that says something like < Boom! You're a Protestant now. Pray for them. They want the spotlight and news headlines. They long for those things so they can in their twisted mind, convince themselves that they are doing the right thing.
We can't do anything about what Protestants allow in their churches. The local Bishop I guess could ask them, as due diligence, not to hold the circus. Imagine if the LDS asked a Catholic Church to stop baptisms because they believe it's false. That wouldn't go over so well (I hope).
Everyone wants to be a rebel and these women are acting like spiritual adolescents. The more we tell them no, the more they will seek the scandal.
I'd love nothing more than to go in and flip some tables but I think we're past the time of effectiveness for that action with this group of women.
Let us send them some Mystic Monk coffee laced with Blessed Salt.
I rather suspect that nothing will be said by the current Archbishop of Chicago (where the many-decades habit of referring to the local ordinary simply as “the Cardinal” has become “the Car…, I mean ‘the Archbishop'”) will make no public complaints, unless of course some of them happened to be from Poland.
Is there any history of a local ordinary where such a non-ordination took place saying anything to the hosting facility in such an instance?
It’s interesting to compare this with what happened to the permanent deacons of Chicago a few years ago:
We used to have an annual meeting at a local (MO Syn.) Lutheran college, because it was large enough, centrally located, affordable, and (unlike a comparable Catholic college a few blocks away) seemed happy to have us. Then a few years ago, a new administration (either of the school or a new bishop, I don’t recall) decided it was unseemly to have a group of ordained Catholics meeting on their campus, even when their students weren’t there.
Just now at the Institute of Catholic Culture, listening to Alice von Hildebrand, her talk, Mulieris Dignitatem, and at the 49:00 mark says this: “He (the priest), should represent Christ, his personality should vanish… In this moment he is an alter Christos. …Only one priest in the whole world,…The conclusion that I draw …is that is that there is only one priest, one! In the whole world. And that is Christ, Christ himself! And this priest has a mother, and this mother is Mary. And being the mother of the only priest, it explains why it is impossible for the church to consecrate women. Because you cannot be mother and son simultaneously. The greatness of women is to be the mother of Priests. And Mary was the Mother of the only Priest, and this is why it is impossible that she should play the role of her Son.”
Alice hits one to the moon!
The most sacred rites of the Catholic Church are Holy Mass and ordination to Holy Orders.
Sorry, Father, you get a “fail” on this one. The Holy Eucharist is deemed the most sacred of the Sacraments (cf. CCC #1211).
[Sorry, you just got your own fail. First, I said “sacred rites”. Also, Eucharist is both the Blessed Sacrament Itself and Its celebration. No Mass, no Eucharist. No priest, no Mass, no Eucharist.]
You need a mystical understanding of the Mystical Body of Christ in order to understand the male priesthood. The relationship between Christ and His Church is said to be spousal. Christ is the Bridegroom and the Church is His Bride. When a husband and a wife enter into the one flesh union it is the man who enters into the woman. Likewise, in conception it is the male sperm that swims up to and enters into the female egg. It seems clear that the act of entering within is a male act. The male is the doer of intimacy. The female is the one who receives this intimacy. This explains why Christ came as a male, and why male terms like Father and Son are used to describe God, and why the Church is called Holy Mother Church.
*
Because of the Hypostatic Union, Christ is One Person in two natures, divine and human. The priest acts In Persona Christi, in the person of Christ. In Holy Orders during the ordination the priest is configured to Christ in a very special way. As such, Holy Orders is in the image and likeness of the Hypostatic Union. The priest is the living icon of Christ. Consecrated women religious are considered to be brides of Christ.
*
The priest acts In Persona Christi during the Consecration. In the sacrament of the Holy Eucharist during the Consecration the Real Presence of Christ enters into and becomes one with the bread and the wine. Transubstantiation at its core is a male act. The Body and Blood in a similar fashion enter into the communicant. The Holy Eucharist is a sacrament that is permeated with Christ’s maleness, and gives us a foreshadowing of the final nuptial union that is described in Revelation.
*
Women don’t have to be priests to have an impact on the Church. We can begin with the Blessed Virgin Mary and the women disciples. There are many important women saints: St. Teresa of Avila, St. Catherine of Siena, St Thérèse of Lisieux, and St. Faustina for starters.
*
Any woman who thinks that she has a calling from the Holy Spirit needs to study the works of St. Teresa of Avila, who is a Doctor of the Church. She wrote extensively about prayer and mysticism. St. Teresa was also a reformer who sought to restore a spiritual focus to the Carmelite Order that had fallen into lax spiritual practices. St. John of the Cross joined her in this reform effort. They both met with considerable opposition to their reform efforts. St. John was taken prisoner, jailed, and flogged.
*
The arguments that are being made in an attempt to redefine the priesthood are very similar to the arguments being used in an attempt to redefine marriage.
Ooooobviously, one needs the Sacrament of Orders to confect the Eucharist. That’s not the point. The point is that, by either definition, the Holy Eucharist is still the most sacred of the Church’s “rites.” Cf. the CCC and Aquinas.
Ldunne,
The attribution *most sacred* can be considered in different ways. Considered in one way all the rites that confect a Sacrament can be considered *the most sacred* from the fact that they confect a Sacrament. Considered in another way, the Mass is *the most sacred* because of the Most Holy Eucharist is the Sacrament of Sacraments. Still, considered in another way the Consecration of a Church could be considered *the most sacred* because of the rigorous preparation the minister must undergo before he performs the rite (especially in the former rite where the Bishop had to fast for three days among other strict preparations).
This is a silly thing to argue about.