"The great Father Zed, Archiblogopoios"
- Fr. John Hunwicke
"Some 2 bit novus ordo cleric"
"Rev. John Zuhlsdorf, a traditionalist blogger who has never shied from picking fights with priests, bishops or cardinals when liturgical abuses are concerned."
"Father John Zuhlsdorf is a crank"
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"the hate-filled Father John Zuhlsford" [sic]
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“Given that Rorate Coeli and Shea are mad at Fr. Z, I think it proves Fr. Z knows what he is doing and he is right.”
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"Father Z’s Blog is a bright star on a cloudy night."
"A cross between Kung Fu Panda and Wolverine."
Fr. Z is officially a hybrid of Gandalf and Obi-Wan XD
Rev. John Zuhlsdorf, a scrappy blogger popular with the Catholic right.
- America Magazine
RC integralist who prays like an evangelical fundamentalist.
-Austen Ivereigh on Twitter
[T]he even more mainline Catholic Fr. Z. blog.
-Deus Ex Machina
“For me the saddest thing about Father Z’s blog is how cruel it is.... It’s astonishing to me that a priest could traffic in such cruelty and hatred.”
- Jesuit homosexualist James Martin to BuzzFeed
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- Paul in comment at 1 Peter 5
"I am a Roman Catholic, in no small part, because of your blog.
I am a TLM-going Catholic, in no small part, because of your blog.
And I am in a state of grace today, in no small part, because of your blog."
- Tom in comment
"Thank you for the delightful and edifying omnibus that is your blog."- Reader comment.
"Fr. Z disgraces his priesthood as a grifter, a liar, and a bully. - - Mark Shea
Glad to see that he delivers his homily while seated – as a Bishop should.
Thanks to Archbishop Sample, and also to you, Fr. Z. We all must listen and hear!
Striking to see the clerical monks all tip their skufias (if that’s the proper name for them) each time His Excellency spoke the name of Jesus during his homily too.
I don’t think that , to date, I’ve heard anyone else mention how frequently Pope Francis has spoken about the work of the devil either . . . well worth the listen.
Thanks for posting the video Padre.
What a beautiful message that has so many applications in our lives.
Oh, that we had such an Archbishop in our Diocese. Pray for them all.
I listened to the sermon. Although I think unity is what *all* Catholics want. But the question is, “Unity based on *what*?”. Unity makes us united in mission, which mission? How we give God his due in worship is not an insignificant matter. We are to worship God in spirit and in truth. Lex Orandi, Lex Credendi, Lex Vivendi. It embodies how we fulfill the first half of the Greatest Commandment (Matthew 22:36-40).
Take just two issues as an example.
Admittedly Ad Deum versus Ad Populum embody two different theologies, and to say it’s just personal preference embodies yet another theology. Ad Deum is the form shared by pre-Vatican II Catholics, Eastern Catholics, the Orthodox, the Copts, Jews (they just replace the tabernacle with the Torah), and Muslims.
Communion in the hand horrifies pre-Vatican II Catholics, Eastern Catholics, the Orthodox, the Copts, as would touching the Ark of the Covenant to Jews and Muslims by anyone else than a properly ritually prepared priest.
In other words,
(1) Ad Deum and banning communion in the hand is foundational to all pre-Reformation Abrahamic faiths.
(2) Similarly, it can be shown that Ad Populum and ensuring communion in the hand is foundational to all modern faiths.
(3) Saying it doesn’t matter betrays yet one more faith that sees that worship is a personal preference and needs to be downplayed to get to “the real mission of the Church”.
(4) Being practical, namely admitting we’re in bad shape, but so much damage is done in the NO that it would be impossible to return to TLM Church wide, so we need a “reform of the reform” and God will accept our bad worship in the mean time, is yet one more faith.
People in the 4th camp can be said to share in some of the mission of camps 1 and see camp 3 as a prime target for evangelization while working with them in other areas. But we can’t pretend we have the same mission, and more than we can pretend that it doesn’t matter if you’re Catholic or Orthodox even if we can work together to a common goal.
Wow. Now I don’t only miss living in Portland for the geography, but for having a great archbishop, too!
He speaks really clearly, and while making meaningful, solidly grounded points.
It’s troubled me for a long time that so many people go beyond worrying about losing access to Extraordinary or even the Ordinary form (I’ve honestly heard it warned about, although I think only as hyperbole, and I can’t stifle a laugh each time) of the Mass, to bickering and trying to undermine one or the other. Meanwhile, I just think how amazing it would be if we could even get the Ordinary form celebrated consistently as instructed and with reverent participation instead of indifference from a clear majority of those present.
That alone would be massive progress, and not only positive for the direct benefit of those attending the Ordinary form, but fostering consistent reverence there would, I’m sure, have the double effect of fostering greater interest in the Extraordinary form.
I share your sentiment Sword40.
I believe the Novus Ordo is having agonal respirations. I pray that I outlive it. The spiritual arc of my life will then be measured from the daily sung TLM I experienced as a fourth grader to hopefully a requiem in the Extraordinary Form.
The spiritual wreckage of my extended family I blame largely on the Novus Ordo. The body parts are littered through the decades. I currently have no access to the TLM. I pray to Padre Pio daily that my children will not lose faith and one day soon have access to the Mass of Ages.
There is a great urgency to my supplication. Call me triumphilist and contrary to the spirit of this post, but the Novus Ordo cannot be smashed soon enough.
“imagine what we could accomplish were we to set aside some of our minor differences and work together in a more unified way…”.
And if we worked together for the glory of God, all in the same language (that is constant so that we could understand one another, regardless of where we were from) we could even build a city that would reach to Heaven!
Isn’t that our job?
@Akita – “The Novus Ordo cannot be smashed soon enough.”
I am a mainstream Catholic who is VERY sympathetic to Trad sentiments and sensibilities. (I attend a TLM once a month, and forego Mass at my liturgically liberal parish to attend a much more reverent Mass.) But when I hear language like that, it makes me think that some mainstreams can be forgiven for some of their distrust and anxiety toward Trads.
“And if we worked … all in the same language … we could even build a city that would reach to Heaven!”
KateD, my sarcasm detector’s getting indeterminate readings — did you mean to compare Latin to the Tower of Babel?
“But when I hear language like that, it makes me think that some mainstreams can be forgiven for some of their distrust and anxiety toward Trads.”
Then perhaps the same talk can be given at an NO Mass? I have NEVER heard one thing positive on the EF at the latter. Or on any other received and approved rite either, for that matter. It’s still a stacked deck against the EF.
No. Latin would be the antidote.
The Tower of Babel was constructed out of human arrogance and so God thwarted it by removing man’s ability to communicate in one language.
The City of God is a spiritual reality that is built for the greater glory of God. It’s good for to have a common language for that work.
Have you ever tried to work with someone when there is no shared language? It is difficult and there are a lot of misunderstandings.
Well, personally, I find I have more misunderstandings when people think they speak my language, ;^) but fair point — that’s why I asked.
“The spiritual wreckage of my extended family I blame largely on the Novus Ordo. The body parts are littered through the decades. I currently have no access to the TLM. I pray to Padre Pio daily that my children will not lose faith and one day soon have access to the Mass of Ages.”
I grew up in the Novus Ordo. I turned out fine (I think). My parents were dedicated to catechesis both at church and at home, adhering to instructions of the Church, including fast and abstinence, and going to confession frequently, while setting the example we were expected to follow. Making note of and explaining the liturgical abuses we were exposed to growing up helped, too.
You do realize that there is A LOT happening in the world to try to draw people away from the church than just the introduction of the Novus Ordo, right? Moral relativity and consumerism are among several powerful tools the devil uses to draw the faithful away from church.
Traditionalists could do a great service by admitting that the use of the 1962 Roman Missal is a stopgap measure until we have a Pope with a bit more liturgical courage to undertake a merging of the two forms. It will never again be the sole, primary instruction for the conduct of the Roman Mass.
I’m not quite sure how to say this…..but there seems to be something of a “cult of unworthiness” mindset among many in the traditionalist camp. A mindset that holds that your everyday Catholic simply isn’t that important to the conduct of worship. We talk frequently here about the use of Latin, and advocates of it often argue something to the effect of “well if it was used, people would understand it” – but I think there is also the sentiment “you don’t need to understand it – the Priest is getting business done and so you can sit quietly over in the corner and say your rosary”. And this is coming from someone whose sympathies are far more with the traditionalists than the liberals.
What does the future of Catholic worship look like? It probably most closely resembles the Anglican Ordinate – but probably with more of the Mass said Versus Populum, lay readings, reception on the hand, more or less the current number of hymns, and other major hallmarks of the NO.
….and I have to say this again: if Catholics had a regular worship outlet outside of the Sacrifice of the Mass, you probably could keep the liturgical dancers and praise bands and lay preaching out of the Mass.
Archbishop Sample’s homily does have resonance for all of us. I personally find that the Mass of Paul VI in the Vernacular with its extended use of Scripture combined with the Eternal Sacrifice provides fuller sustinence of my faith. However, I recognize that the Church in Her wisdom also allows for celebration in not only the Mass of Pius V, but also the Domincan Rite, the Ambrosian Rite, and the vrarious liturgies of the Eastern Uniate Churches. As G.K. Chesterton observed the genius of Catholicism resides in its recognition that that that which is not forbidden is permitted rather than a view that that which is not explicitly permitted is forbidden.
I’m almost surely going to get in trouble for this but, here goes:
I don’t know whether we should presume that everyone would be able to speak Latin. I have several good friends who are deaf & mute, and sign language is not universal – so one would further need to do something about unifying all the sign languages too: American sign language isn’t even the same as British sign language.
And what about St Jean Vianney – the Curé of Ars ? He had a lot of trouble trying to learn Latin (and this was way, way, pre-OF) – almost left the seminary because of it, and was considered only marginally fit to be a priest . . . but God did just fine with him and today he’s the patron saint of all parish priests.
St. André Bessette – the founder of St. Joseph’s Oratory here in Montreal is another example. He was practically illiterate – could barely navigate the Gospels , but God was working miracles through him daily. He also became a saint.
It really is our hearts that have to be ready – not so much our tongues.
Very nice sermon!. Thanks for sharing Father!. My analysis. The only hermeneutic of continuity that I see between both forms of the Roman rite today, is the Anglican USE or Ordinariate Mass for the Ordinary form. And our Extraordinary Form. I deeply feel that the damage between both Forms, the Anglican USE excluded, is beyond repair. I also feel that a real schism is brewing. Not over the Liturgy, but other aspects of our Church. (German Hierarchy. Church tax bringing excommunication) cough!. Anyway. I wish Archbishop Sample could convince the SSPX to join forces. That would be what I hope and pray for. Again Father thanks for sharing. Archbishop Sample another candidate for the next Pope. :).
Grumpy Beggar – No trouble. Discussion is good.
Really, there’s a place for both in today’s Church, but Latin has been suppressed nearly to the point of extinction and needs champions :)
When we attend the EF, it’s normally the low Mass, and so we don’t say anything. I read along in my missal, some people pray the rosary….speaking is not necessary. The choir sings, and we may too, but that’s no different than at an OF Mass as far as that goes, right?
Saint Jean Vianney learned Latin well enough to read the Mass, and if St. Andre Bessette had attended Mass in New York City (or Mexico City), he would’ve understood it to the same extent that her understood it in Montreal……which was well enough, I suppose.
Of course, you’re right….what ever tongue the Mass is said in, it’s most important to strive for a heart that is pleasing to God.
I am so glad to hear Archbishop Sample’s sermon, so needed in today’s disintegrating world and all too often demoralized church. So glad Portland in Orgon has a bishop willing to celebrate the TLM. I spent a few years in that massively progressive neighborhood, which nearly destroyed me. I survived, by the grace of God, and grew. The NW, last I heard, was one of the most unchurched areas of the US. Really, everybody up there needs to pull together (well, everyplace else as well). What a blessing to have such a pastor! Thanks, Fr. Z, for edifying the Body, as you do daily.
“When we attend the EF, it’s normally the low Mass, and so we don’t say anything. I read along in my missal, some people pray the rosary….speaking is not necessary. The choir sings, and we may too, but that’s no different than at an OF Mass as far as that goes, right?”
While this is the usual practice in the Extraordinary Form, it is not what Pope Pius XII envisioned when he issued his encyclical Mediator Dei in 1947, calling for participation “with such earnestness and concentration that they might be united as closely as possible with the High Priest, according to the Apostle ‘Have this mind in you which was also in Christ Jesus.’ (Phillipians 2,5). And together with Him and through Him let them make their oblation, and in communion with Him let them offer up themselves . . . so that the faithful, united with the Priest, may pray together in the very words and sentiments of the Church.” His intent was set forth in an Instruction issued by the Congregation of Rites on September 3, 1958 that urged dialogue participation by the faithful attending the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. It encouraged (and saw as its ultimate goal) that the faithful attending a Low Mass would recite all of the responses and prayers of the server plus recitation with the priest of the Gloria, the Creed, the Sanctus and the Agnus Dei.
Gerard, the dialogue Mass makes sense, but I think Pius XII’s goal had to lead to the abolition of the Prayers at the Foot of the Altar. One cannot recite them easily as a group. Yes, their form and obligation come later than other parts, but they tend to be greatly favored.
As far as the future of the Roman Rite goes, 1962 is a stopgap, but for the other direction. I believe that the Ordinary Form gets right things that were right in editions prior to 1962, but that in the name of simplicity makes things worse. The calendar and the problematic date of the feast of S. Irenaeus on either the vigil of S. Peter and Paul, July 3, or by itself sans vigil is a great example. The OF not only ripped out much of the post-Carolingian development but attempted to impose a pre-Gregorian form, and novelties came in because the scholars thought they knew better than received tradition.
Only then can we go forward.
His Excellency is, of course, correct. However, the line isn’t as much between the EF and NO, but rather orthodoxy and heterodoxy. For example, I’ve had the privilege of attending reverent NO Masses in different cities, such as Detroit. Latin is in use, as well as the communion rail and, on many occasions, the Mass is said ad orientem. Silence is observed in the Church before and after Mass, as well. There is a clear sense of identity.
Contrast this to what many people think of as happening in the NO: ad populum, altar girls in cassocks, social justice, et al. We do need to stand unified in the face of the culture. However, the emphasis should be put on Catholic identity rather than the form of the mass. If this can be accomplished, public scandal would decrease – from both elected officials and catholic universities – and the strength of the Church Militant would increase.
Love you Grumpy Beggar!
What a simply wonderful sermon. Would that more clerics would preach with such honesty, sincerity, and clarity.
Unfortunately what I see in many of the comments here, to varying degrees, is to a greater or lesser extent what +Sample was talking about – placing ourselves in camps, arguing only that the position we have already taken is the only one plausible. Indeed, as one commenter said above, it’s quite likely that the only way this will eventually get fixed is by a Pope with sufficient courage – and I would add to that humility and clarity of thought – to do away with all the divisions and look at every single question with the full breadth and depth of our Catholic experience and answer once and for all in which way the question must be addressed. Until that day, as for us, let us remember that the only way to learn is to listen, and the only way to convert someone is in relationship not in mere submission.
I pray for unity. I don’t expect to see it in my lifetime, but I do hold hope that my children might see it in theirs, and that is in the end all the consolation for which I could hope in this vale of tears.
mburn, I tend to agree with the future goal of a reform of the reform effecting a merger of the two forms in a unified Roman rite, perhaps with some limited use of the vernacular as envisioned at Vatican II, which never contemplated the Eucharistic rite itself in the vernacular.
But I’d suggest it’s best not to get hung up over Latin, one way or the other. I myself understand liturgical Latin readily, but at EF Mass I pray largely in English, following the priest’s Latin prayer in the English rather than the Latin column of my hand missal. Whereas at a vernacular OF Mass I tend to follow instead in the Latin column, for the same reason–to make the prayers somewhat more consciously my own.
Likewise, at the EF Masses I attend, no one is off in the corner praying the rosary, and practically no one exhibits the 30-yard stares not infrequently seen at OF Sunday Masses. Almost all appear to be following the action of the priest, using their missals to unite themselves consciously with his prayers, thus following the advice of Popes X through XII to participate in the liturgy meaningly and prayerfully. Perhaps one benefit of Latin is that it forces the use of a hand missal in order to participate understandably. Whereas at a vernacular Mass sans missal it’s all too tempting to zone out and drift in to passive couch-potato mode.
Ecola State Park, 90 min. due west of Portland, is–in my estimation–the most beautiful place on earth on a sunny summer day. Due east is Mount Hood. Of course, Portland also has Voodoo Donuts, which (as I learned waiting an hour in line to get a donut) people from all over the world go to for its novelty. I lived in Portland, and there is an underbelly of darkness there, but–believe it or not–there is also a radiant brightness! The Grotto (The National Sanctuary of our Sorrowful Mother) there is also phenomenal :)
Dear Henry Edwards,
Your observation concerning the utility of a hand missal applies just as much to celebration of the Ordinary Form in the vernacular. I have always possessed one and have continued to do so with the current translation (I even have a copy of the interim missal that was issued between the 1962 missal and the promulgation of the OF). Our parish (and many of the parishes in our Archdiocese) have the paperback or pamphlet-style yearly or seasonal books that contain the Proper prayers and the readings for Sunday. It certainly assists in maintaining focus on the central Mystery that we celebrate.
Since Archbishop Sample has come to Portland, I notice the priest celebrants have restored reverence and sense of the sacred during the Eucharistic prayer and the Consecration. To me, this is mostly non-verbal, and oh-so welcome and important to the entire Mass.
Those who adhere to the EF should respect the OF: That’s what I take away from this, given that the sermon was delivered at an EF Mass. I hope Archbishop Sample gives the same sermon at OF Masses. That’s what would give salience to the other half of his message, which is that those who adhere to the OF should respect the EF.
Catholics are disunited over liturgy because they disagree about what’s good for the Church. It’s not enough to tell people to stop believing what they believe. We don’t change hearts and minds by saying, “Change your heart and mind!”
Some people honestly see the EF as a distraction and a digression from the great postconciliar movement forward. We may think their view is distorted, but it’s what they see, and they act on that perception in good faith. It’s the view that Pope Francis seemed to hint at recently, on the fiftieth anniversary of the first vernacular Mass said by a pope. And that view seems to be shared by many chanceries around the world: Tolerate the EF on paper, discourage it in practice.
At the other end of the spectrum, yes, some people see the OF as a disruption in the Church’s liturgical life. This view is the mirror image of the other side’s view of the EF as distraction and digression.
Neither side has persuaded the other. One side asks, Wouldn’t the Church as presently constituted be more united if the small but vocal minority who adhere to the EF gave it up and started attending the OF exclusively? It’s a fair question. Meanwhile, it’s fair for the other side to ask, How did the introduction of the Novus Ordo not disrupt the Church’s liturgical life? And that’s a fair question.
It’s tempting to see the disagreement as a dialectic: Each side has only partial truth, and the disagreement will be resolved only by a synthesis of the two sides. Benedict with his hermeneutic of continuity made that vision seem plausible. Francis is making it seem implausible.
I always carry to OF Mass my 3450-page (British) CTS hand missal, the only one I’m familiar with that includes both the propers and the ordinary of the Mass with the Latin alongside the new English translation. However, I see very few others with similar hand missals at OF Masses, whereas most folks at EF Masses I attend either have their own hand missals or use the ubiquitous red Latin-English missalettes (usually together with propers leaflets).
My point was that a Mass celebrated in Latin (whether OF or EF) virtually requires one to use a hand missal which assures conscious prayerful participation in the liturgy. Whereas at a vernacular OF Mass there’s the temptation–which many apparently fall prey to–to eschew the use of missal or worship aid, and drift into couch-potato mode oblivious to the liturgical action, a mode wholly lacking in the participatio actuosa urged by Vatican II.
If you know the Latin Novus Ordo by heart and don’t use a worship aid for it, it is possible to be an oblivious couch potato at Latin Mass. On the other hand it is possible to be recollected at any kind of Mass.
Wow. The Truth of the Faith, spoken uncompromisingly and clearly, is the most powerful and persuasive witness there is. The man communicates a Faith that is worth devoting your life to and dying for. This is the Truth that brings forth Priestly vocations in strong men.
Indeed, Elizabeth, though over the decades I’ve attended a few Masses so raucous that focused recollection was a challenge I may not have been equal to.
But, paradoxically, conscious participation in a Latin Mass may actually be heightened by lack of familiarity with Latin, since use of a hand missal is so conducive to focus and comprehension. Perhaps an English (only) speaker could experience the same effect at a Mass in Spanish using a Spanish-English hand missal (if there exists such a thing).
I’m reminded of a remark about St. Robert Ballarmine (I believe) that, although he know the whole Divine Office by heart, he never said his Office by memory, but always recited it from a Divine Office book in order to remain focused on the words and meaning, this being more difficult when reciting something by memory.
In my experience of the Mass prior to the introduction of the Mass of Paul VI, most attendees did not possess a missal. Rather, they often engaged in private devotions whether it was praying the rosary or bringing a book of prayers which might or might not have the Ordinary of the Mass in English included. Consequently, there was not a habit in place to encourage purchase of a hand missal when the Mass of Paul VI was introduced. It is partially this that explains the lack of personally-owned missals by attendees at OF Masses.
It is also difficult to make accurate comparisons of the current respective populations of attendees. The fact that the EF must be sought out naturally self-selects a group containing more people who would make the extra effort to obtain a missal.
Thanks for the clarification (on the “no trouble” part too – I should probably make a point of not posting when I’m tired ).
You’re right, eventually St. Jean Vianney did learn Latin well enough to celebrate/offer the holy Sacrifice of the Mass. But in the seminary he did fail his exams ,twice, before ever reaching that point. And on one of those occasions a Father Balley had to intercede for him with the examiners after he’d failed to pass for the higher seminary.
Also true, as you say, that, at that time, “if St. Andre Bessette had attended Mass in New York City (or Mexico City), he would’ve understood it to the same extent that her understood it in Montreal. St. André Bessette came very close to attending Mass in New York: When he was 20 yrs old, he went to New England to seek employment and he stayed in the US for 3 years (entirely Connecticut based though -Moosup, Hartford and Phoenixville). According to his principal biographer, Fr. H.P. Bergeron, C.S.C., “It was in the designs of God that he came to the United States, the better to be put personally to the test, and the more readily in the future to spread the devotion to St. Joseph.”
Father John Hardon S.J. says the Liturgy has been celebrated in Latin “since apostolic times”, so I personally struggle with the plausibility of Latin actually being done away with any time soon; particularly when I recall that the FSSP is canonically established. Neither are some pious celebrations of the OF totally devoid of Latin. Les Petits Chanteurs du Mont Royal, at that same St. Joseph’s Oratory are known to offer a most moving rendition of the Kyrie (Eleison) on some Sundays during the Penitential Rite.
The entire situation is much more complicated than this, but on a larger scale, I try to view it from 2 different simple perspectives: 1 – Outside the Church, 2. – Inside the Church. So I perceive::
Proponents of Communion for : those who are divorced and remarried , for those who are unmarried and are engaging in pre-marital sexual relationships , etc – already adhere to No. 1 and are intent on bringing that pestilential approach into the Church and forcing it on well-intentioned believers; which increases the erosive degree/rate of No. 2 .
To me, one of the most immediately accessible remedies is adoration of the Blessed Sacrament. One is given a profound sense of the sacred in any of the adoration chapels we have throughout the world, immediately upon visiting. No language is required. Regardless of which form of the Holy Mass we may attend, we can all attend adoration, and without any impediments: We understand our Blessed Lord is there, present – live and in Person and He knows we’re there.
Until others begin to find Him in Adoration, I think it is probably up to us to try to visit Him on a regular basis. That would definitely be one concrete way of putting into practice what Most Reverend Alexander Sample is intimating : Every single Adoration chapel is a little “house united” , where we can, as one, love Christ in this Sacrament of His infinite humility – regardless of any other differences.
@ SanSan : Thank-you for the kind encouragement – comments duly noted. I think almost all of us would agree that we hold those very same sentiments for Fr. Z and for this great blog which continues to probe our hearts. I’ll be praying a decade of the Rosary specifically for your and for Fr. Z’s intentions directly after posting this . . . then, I’m going to need a break.
In response to a recent post, I would like to add that I agree with Elizabeth D : “It is possible to be recollected at any kind of Mass” , particularly if we can remain aware of Whom we believe will be made present at the consecration. Of course, distractions in any language, form, shape, color, smell, volume, never really serve a facilitative function to our being recollected.
As somebody who grew up with the Old Rite, I would like to correct a poster here – most people, especially in New York City where I lived, had hand missals. That’s why when somebody’s mother died, everybody had to wonder what to do with her missal, which was stuffed with holy cards and funeral cards that she had picked up. In fact, very often, the father of the family also had such a missal, or if he was older, a book of devotions for men with the text of the mass in English.
There were, of course, always people who prayed the Rosary at mass, but a lot of the time, they were from immigrant cultures and while it didn’t seem as if they were paying attention, they were – the Rosary was like “white noise” to screen out distractions. Of course, there is the famous joke about the Italian lady praying at an image of Our Lady – when suddenly Jesus spoke to her. And she says, of course, “be quiet, I’m talking to your mother…”
But people really did know what the mass was, much more so than they do now, and in the US (and most modern European countries, particularly France, Spain and England) hand missals had been in production for a long time and were heavily used. They were often quite beautiful and featured original art or reproductions of fine art.
That said, I didn’t mind the introduction of the vernacular, although I thought more of the Latin should have been retained. It was the Novus Ordo form (1970) that I found difficult and in fact which I found lacking. Translating the Old Mass wasn’t really the problem, although I do think that abandoning Latin as the language of the Church was a problem and has led to much misunderstanding and also a lower quality of priests. If a man couldn’t learn Latin (and they didn’t need to be able to converse with Caesar or even a mediaeval pope, just have a basic reading knowledge) this was a sign that God had something else in mind for him.
IRRC, the father of Therese found his vocation in becoming the father of a saint – and a future saint himself – because he was never able to learn Latin to the level to make it through seminary. So God has his own plans.
In any case, getting back to Apb Sample – I’d never heard of him until the last few months, but he sounds wonderful. He always takes a somewhat unexpected approach to an issue.
@ Elizabeth D: I disagree that one can be recollected at both forms of the Mass… if I may be so bold to suggest, I think Saint Teresa of Avila, who struggled with distraction, would not have been recollected at the OF. Some people can read/study with a TV blaring in the background (which is what the OF is like to me) whereas others find it IMPOSSIBLE to do so. In fact, cloistered convents have explicitly stated they have switched to the EF because the OF does NOT lend itself to contemplation.
I was acquainted with an amazing piece of sacred art recently –
that has RADICALLY changed how I participate at the Holy Mass, in the EF (which I have access to 7 days/week). Impossible to use this meditative tool in the OF — so noisy, and so much missing like the offertory.
There are excellent prayer guides [I use one written by St Jean Baptiste de la Salle] to the Holy Mass that can really help lift someone out of a rut of mindlessly reading the Ordinaries in a Missal [happens to me, unfortunately]. I love this form of meditation, too, but cannot apply it at the OF, again due to the non-stop noise and shortened canon bereft of silence.
If anyone cares to follow the link I posed in above post, here is a written guide to it, from Father Carota’s blog,
Thanks for the link to the meditation. I’m at a loss for words. I often use images in my mind from The Passion while praying the Sorrowful Mysteries.
I wonder if someone who is not well catechised and attends a more relaxed and busy OF Mass would understand what was happening, even after watching the video?
I grew up with the Tridentine Mass but had not attended for many many years. When suddenly I was given the opportunity to attend an EF Mass several times a week. Even from the start I found that I rarely looked at the English side of the missal page, except for the Propers. I do not know why this is.
I have two of my grandmother’s prayer books, one from 1925 and one from 1947. Both have the order of the Mass, suggested prayers for different parts of the Mass plus the Propers for Sundays. I haven’t felt the need to use them yet but they may be useful during Mass someday–does one eventually find it boring?. The prayers in the books are good for any time.
EoinOBolguidhir: You put into words exactly what I can’t express- Archbishop Sample is such a great blessing! praying there will be more to come…
There isn’t an “underbelly of darkness” in Portland, there is a dark overcoat of evil enveloping the region. Nearly every other bumper sticker there says “Keep Portland Weird.” And the The Grotto (The National Sanctuary of our Sorrowful Mother) was constructed during the time of that the Extraordinary Form was in its zenith.
Archbishop Alexander Sample’s sermon seems to echo those used in 1923 by Archbishop Alexander Christie at he dedication ceremony for Portland’s Grotto:
On May 29, 1924, three thousand people gathered for the first Mass and dedication of the Sanctuary of Our Sorrowful Mother. At the blessing, Archbishop Alexander Christie offered this prayer:
“Let this be a sanctuary of peace for all peoples of the earth and surely in this day a sanctuary is needed. Torn with differences, strife, and grief, the world needs sanctuary where the human spirit can seek peace and consolation.”
Years ago I went to seminary with Archbishop Sample (it’s so hard not to simply say “Alex!”) and it was a true blessing to be close to this holy man. He is that rare example of unflinching orthodoxy combined with unmistakable love for God and his fellow man.
@ Latin Mass Type –
I am glad it moved you, too. It has completely changed how I participate at Holy Mass… since watching it, I can use no book at Mass and be moved to tears just by observing the rubrics performed by the priest. I nearly lose it when the Priest unveils the chalice, or adds a drop of water (Our Lady’s tear) to the chalice… and now, when I see his anointed hand make the sign of the Cross over the species 5 times, I see nails and blood… and that first genuflection corresponding to the post slamming into the ground– GOD have Mercy!! If this is what Padre Pio saw each time he offered Holy Mass, no wonder he wept!!
I can’t help but think a person who has never attended the EF would also be moved, even if not fully aware of what is going on. e.g., I was awe-struck at my first TLM (2008), even though lost/unable to follow where we were in the Missal, and I wonder if having one’s heart so moved isn’t a special grace infused, perhaps a favor from our Angel Guardian.
The Ordinary prayers and their translations @ the TLM are majestic and beautiful; no one should ever grow bored of them! Not ever, just as one could/should never be bored of the Our Father or Hail Mary. I probably need meditative aids more than the average person due to an excessively distracted mind… but *no* aid ever gave my attention a jolt as much as that video has. I’m most grateful to whomever produced it; God reward them.
@ Absit Invidia,
I grew up in the PDX archdiocese and could go on and on with stories that make that prayer pale… sodomite couples listed together in the parish directory; openly sodomite “prayer and worship” committee leader; parish bulletin recommending family counseling at said sodomite’s practice (is a shrink); liturgical dancing… Obama stickers galore.
I pray specifically for Archbishop Sample (and for Archbishop Cordileone) at EVERY MASS.
They are like the Delta Force, operating in the enemy’s battle space… I implore JMJ to protect & reinforce them! I’m heartened by the other post above that says the OF Masses in PDX are becoming more reverent… it all starts at the top. Deo gratias.
New Sister, thank you for posting the video……have shared with many…….just absolutely beautiful!
While Archbishop Sample’s words are encouraging, there are some big issues that he has yet to address in his own backyard. The chief issue is OCP (Oregon Catholic Press).
OCP perpetuates bad music (English and Spanish) that many parishes, including my own and several in my diocese, use. This publishing house, located in the Archdiocese of Portland, has done more damage to the sacred nature of the Mass with its wretched music.
Not a few of us expected Archbishop Sample to come in with the same enthusiasm that he had while at Marquette. Nothing has happened. OCP continues to spread like a cancer and nobody seems to care. Yes, some can argue that one’s parish doesn’t have to subscribe to this stuff, but, pastors and parish music directors have become intoxicated with this vile Kool-Aid that they wouldn’t know sacred music at all.
I reached my boiling point this past Sunday when the choir sang “In These Days of Lenten Journey”, an OCP piece, during the Offertory. The song dealt with celebrating “our wonderful selves”, as the late Fr. Richard John Nehaus would have put it, and had little to nothing to do with imploring God’s mercy. The Spanish language portion is not any better. One of the suggested songs is actually tinged with Liberation Theology.
I just wish that Archbishop Sample would devote some time to cleaning up his own house. For many of us, it has become too much to bear.
Please know that I do have respect for Archbishop Sample, but, one can only take so much of OCP, in any language. I just wish that he would start overturning some tables and clean house. A Metropolitan should have SOME control over what is happening in his Archdiocese.
benedictgal says: “Not a few of us expected Archbishop Sample to come in with the same enthusiasm that he had while at Marquette.” As I watched Sen. Cruz announce his candidacy for the Presidency the other day, the thought occurred to me that although I’m not sure that I want a man like him in the White House, I surely wish that we had more men like him in mitres.