A message to those attacking traditional liturgical worship: “You’ve already lost.”

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About Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

Fr. Z is the guy who runs this blog. o{]:¬)
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  1. APX says:

    The problem we’re running into is immigration changing the demographics of the people in the pews. Priest shortage means they’re bringing in charismatic priests from Africa and India with no sense of liturgical reverence, but are outgoing and interactive during Mass so the people in the pews prefer this. Then there’s immigration changing the demographics of the people in the pews bringing them from cultural Catholic countries (the Philippines) where people aren’t interested in traditional Catholic music at Mass and are unresponsive. Just this Sunday the drum set that was sitting in storage for over 10 years came out for Mass, instead of the psalm tone chanted responsorial psalm we usually have, it was some modern-sounding Spanish song (I’m in Canada. Spanish isn’t a language frequently used here, even among the Filipino community). We have a beautiful pipe organ that works very well and a very competent organist/music director who used to also do the music for our Latin Mass, so there’s no excuse for banal modern P&W music at Mass now. It’s such a disgrace. People actually started applauding after Mass now.

  2. TonyO says:

    Right: both Fr. Z’s post title, and APX’s point above, are correct.

    First, the left / modernists have already lost in the hope to capture “the Church” for their dead souls, on 2 grounds:

    (a) Christ has already won and Satan already lost the big war, the rest is just fleshing out the details of this. In the meantime, there will be skirmishes won or lost, but in the ultimate, Christ’s win will be manifest and glorious.

    (b) The 20th – 21st century modernist attempt to take over has failed to this extent: more than 60% of the Church walked away from them AND from the Church, so that nearly half of those who walked away don’t even pretend they are Catholic any more, and the other half ONLY pretend on Christmas and Easter. Of the remaining 30% to 40% who even believe they are supposed to go to mass every week, only about 25% do actually go every week, but of THAT 25%, the modernists have failed to con the majority into actually wanting the ugly, puerile, and soul-deadening clown mass regime. The few who do actively want that mostly DON’T become priests, so their movement is slated for a death knell in the future.

    However, in the meantime, the ugly modernist liturgico-terrorist influence is corrupting souls and gaining new adherents by being the only game in town, since with TC there are fewer and fewer alternatives. So, far too many people are controlled by having NEVER BEEN EXPOSED to truly beautiful Latin Rite masses, and by the time they are adults raising their own children, many of these cannot even grasp that another kind of mass (than the ugly ones they have been accustomed to) might be better. Their sensibilities have been damaged, often permanently. They are, in a significant sense, not even members of the Latin Rite branch of the Church, almost they are even “unchurched” (in a narrow sense). They don’t so much love the degraded mass regime they have grown into, more they are chained to it and cannot escape its hold on their minds and sensibilities. If you were to ask them, they would say that this degraded mass is what they prefer, but if you able to get them to examine the holes in their souls that such masses don’t fill, and enlighten their understanding that there is a mass that fills those holes, they would become less than satisfied with such masses. But it’s nearly impossible to do that.

  3. Legisperitus says:

    Most of us won’t live to see it, but the Church will be restored.

  4. Not says:

    An old friend who I have lost touch with who was a fallen away Greek Orthodox was coming home from Vietnam on an aircraft carrier when his two buddies asked him to attend Latin Mass on the flight deck by a Jesuit Priest. He felt like he was home in his faith. Once they docked in California his buddies told him they were going to the opening of a new Catholic Church, Consecrated by the Bishop. When they got there it was the “new mass”, and at “half time” as they called it, they brought out clowns and a trampoline. You can imagine the effect this had on him. Looks like they haven’t done away with the clowns.

  5. HyacinthClare says:

    Who is “Uncle Arthur”?

  6. rdb says:

    I am convinced that they feel about the TLM the way orthodox Catholics think about the worship of Pachamama. Just as we would fight anyone who wanted to worship an image of Pachamama in a church, they want to fight anyone who wants to worship God through the TLM. As far as vocations and the evangelization of the generations that follow them, I can say with certainty – THEY. DON’T. CARE. No one before them and no one after them has anything to offer this generation. We must remember that this group of clerics will see the almost complete destruction of the Church before they would consider that they might be wrong. My term for this group of clerics is Iconoclastic Narcissists. They have iconoclastic tendencies but narcissism is their deepest identity.

  7. Dave P. says:


    I wouldn’t categorize all Indian and African priests that way. You might be surprised at how strong the Latin Mass Communities are in Africa. The FSSP and Institute of Christ King both run missions there. In fact, the Institute was founded in Gabon. And remember where Cardinals Sarah and Arinze are from…

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