TLM expansion in Mexico

I got this note from a reader:

I have this morning received more news from Mr. Edgar Fernandez of Una Voce Mexico.  Not only will the F.S.S.P. have two priests and its own church (San Pedro Apostol) at Guadalajara, but the Archbishop of Mexico City has also invited it to establish an apostolate.  They will likely send one of their priests from Guadalajara to Mexico City on Sunday afternoons to celebrate Mass, starting later in autumn.  Currently, the Fraternity celebrates Mass daily at San Isidro Labrador Church in Guadalajara.  The priests are Frs. Romanoski and Franz Prosinger[Prosinger had been in Rome, many years ago, as the point man for the FSSP back then.  Those years saw little success.  But now Fr. Kramer is doing a wonderful job.] 

As you may recall, the latter is a polyglot co-founder of the Fraternity in 1988, and was for some years running a mission among the Indians in the Archdiocese of Cuzco, Peru.  He understand that he has special faculties to celebrate the Braga Use [Restricted actually to Braga, however… if I am not mistaken.]  as well as the Roman one.  Once the F.S.S.P. takes charge of San Pedro Apostol, it will offer Gregorian Masses twice on week-days and three or four times on Sundays.
 
Meanwhile, a monastery in Cuernavaca now has the T.L.M. as its conventual Mass (for some time), and there is a Saturday evening Mass of Sunday obligation every Sunday in the Archdiocese of Monterrey.  So Monterrey, Cuernavaca, and Guadalajara currently have every-Sunday Gregorian Masses.  By Christmas, we can likely add Mexico City to that list.
 
Mexicali, Torreon, and Tijuana have T.L.M.s but not on a Sunday basis.  I expect that the Fraternity will soon begin training Mexican diocesan priests!  Alleluia!

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25 Responses to TLM expansion in Mexico

  1. Fr. Angel says:

    The Church in Mexico, once a bastion of orthodoxy and traditional reverence, is undergoing changes from what I hear. Because the Novus Ordo was not implemented there with the widespread abuses seen in Europe and the U.S., but was very restrained and dignified, the Mexican people in general feel spiritually at home with it. Unlike their American counterparts, traditional Mexican Catholics are not hard up to find an escape from out of control Novus Ordo experimentation.

    For instace, I have been told that although the SSPX have a large parish in Mexico City, there is not a clammoring for the EF in Mexico. It is not difficult still for most Mexicans to find very reverent Novus Ordo Masses with solid preaching of the Catholic faith. Thus they do not make demands for an increase of EF Masses.

    However, as more Mexican clergy and religious spend time in the U.S., they tend to take back home American “creativity” with the liturgy. Liturgical music in Mexico especially is affected by the north of the border sound, with cumbias, rythm, and clapping. As the Mexican church starts to liberalize its liturgical practices, the apostolate for the EF may begin to take hold down there.

    It will be interesting to see how the FSSP do in Guadalajara, which under Cardinal Sandoval is still the epicenter of staunch, Mexican orthodoxy.

  2. Deusdonat says:

    Fr Z,

    this is BRILLIANT news! Thank you so much for sharing.

  3. paul says:

    This is so awesome to hear about. I wish the archdiocese of Boston could do the same thing. What an act of charity after so many churches closings etc. I really wish the archdiocese could be pro-active in a positive way why not let the fssp in and have their own church?

  4. porys says:

    Fr.Angel – very similar situation as we have in Poland

  5. Massachusetts Catholic says:

    To Paul,
    Why not go to Cardinal Sean’s blog and put the question to him? Boston certainly needs to keep on boosting morale, which is still low.

  6. Marcin says:

    porys: Fr.Angel – very similar situation as we have in Poland

    Indeed, there\’s not much clamoring for EF in my old country, but similarity can be extended further. For as more laity are spending time in the West, they come back infected with a Communion-on-hand bug. Or maybe it is clergy, too?

    After all, couple of years ago the bishops asked Rome for an indult to distribute on hand. I still wonder whether it was their idea for our obvious betterment, or they succumbed to the requests of some influential lay party? No signs of such aspirations in the parishes, though, so it may have been from the Illuminati. I don’t know. Was laity consulted?

  7. Deusdonat says:

    If communion in the hand is the baseline for deviation from orthodoxy concerning the NO masses, then I would say Mexico has deviated quite drastically (no disrespect, FRAngel). As far back as I can remember, there have always been a mix of people receiving in the hand and in the mouth througout every parish in Mexico City I have been to. The older women usually receive standing and in the mouth, while the younger people receive in the hand (never have I seen any communion rails respected). In Northern Mexico, and in Mexican parishes in the US, the standard is of course mariachi or ranchera music. This is quite alienating for those of us who don’t belong to that specific segment of Mexican culture, but which tends to dominate culturally.

  8. B. says:

    [Prosinger had been in Rome, many years ago, as the point man for the FSSP back then. Those years saw little success. But now Fr. Kramer is doing a wonderful job.]
    Well, Fr. Prosinger wrote his licentiate thesis on “pro multis” at the Institutum Biblicum deconstructing the theory of Joachim Jeremias during that time. As that work was known to Cardinal Ratzinger and might well have influenced the decision on the issue, in a certain way those year saw a very big success.
    Contrary to your opinion Fr. Prosinger comes to the conclusion that it should best be translated without an article, i.e. “for many” and not “for the many”.

  9. Daniel Muller says:

    Details, please! The Benedictines on the north side of Cuernavaca? Which parish in Monterrey??

    Hmm … I am not sure that I have ever seen anyone receive Communion in the hand in hundreds of Masses across Mexico. But then again, I would not really be paying attention.

    Mariachi music, originating in Jalisco (western Mexico), is completely inappropriate for Mass. It belongs in the cantina, as Father Galicia, the choir director at the Metropolitan Cathedral in Mexico City says. It was very disturbing for me to attend a mariachi Mass by mistake in the very same cathedral; it was quite obvious by the amplification used that we were to enjoy the concert, not pray or sing.

    Crummy music at Mexican Masses has its origins in Cuernavaca, by the way, and by way of San Antonio (and possibly other ports of entry) has gained the upper hand in Spanish Masses in the US. As awful as the music is at the English Mass at the US parish I attend, I am never tempted to attend the Spanish Mass. You will generally find much better music in downtown churches in Mexico.

  10. Lucas B. says:

    I knew Father Romanoski had been studying Spanish in Seminary and had gone down to Mexico not long after his ordination. I’m glad to hear he will be able to help set up a new Apostolate down there. Wonderful news!

  11. Manuel says:

    This is good news. I concur that much of Mexico has borrowed from the US. Hopefully, this return to reverence at Mass will increase the faith. It is badly needed as the prots have gained much ground and so has neo-pagan and just general indifference. Witness the fight over abortion being waged now.
    Santa Maria ora pro nobis. Non fecit taliter omni natione.

  12. Mitch says:

    This is great news..I have been in Latin America and they take their faith seriously and it is more prevalent to be spoken about in public circles..There are some beautiful Churches as wherever I went I visited at least one in each city. The only problem i could foresee is the language…Latin Americans are very proud when it comes to their language..Even dialects can not be toyed with..How the Latin language of Rome will rise to the top remains to be seen, but really I am happy to see this…I was wondering how the Moto was going to take some roots in South America…..

  13. Un Mexicano Tradicional says:

    Dear Daniel Mulleret al:

    The Benedictines are on the north side of Cuernavaca (actually in the town of Ahuatepec) on the road to Tepoztlan, to the east. The address is:

    Monasterio Benedictino Nuestra Señora de los Ángeles
    Vía Cuernavaca-Tepoztlán Km 4
    Ahuatepec, Morelos
    Cuernavaca Morelos C.P. 62131

    As for the parish in Monterrey, Nuevo Leon, it is Señor del Perdón. They also have a TLM on Wed. mornings. The address is:

    Parroquia del Señor del Perdón
    Luis Moreno # 5104
    Col. Niño Artillero 64280
    Tel. 8331-0245
    Sábados 5:30 p.m. – Misa de Precepto.
    Miércoles 9:00 am

    It is located in the north-central part of Monterrey, close to San Nicolas de la Garza, near the Main Cemetery.

    I hope this is of use to you all. For additional information, you can also send an email to info@unavocemx.org They can also give you more information on the TLM at the Benedictine Monastery in Ahuatepec, and other Traditional Latin Masses in Mexico. Thank you, Fr. Z for all that you do!

    Nuestra Señora de Guadalupe, Ora pro nobis.

  14. I concur what Fr. Angel has said. At the Spanish Mass in the neighborhood of my area, it\’s very reverent, and virtually no one receives in the hand.

    The translations for the Mass while not being perfect, are much better than the English translations we\’ve been stuck with…I haven\’t heard much as far as people wanting the TLM (The Church hasn\’t been wreckovated and is ready for the TLM) Many of the Traditonal practices are still done (i.e. kneeling for Communion, receiving on the tongue, mantilla\’s etc)

    This is great news for the Church in Mexico.

  15. Antonio says:

    I’m waiting the gregorian rite in Mexico city.

  16. Daniel Muller says:

    Mi estimado mexicano tradicional:

    Thanks so much for the information! I was in Niño Artillero for New Year’s Eve this year; too bad I had gone to Mass downtown at the cathedral …

    I had thought about visiting the Cuernavaca Benedictines in April, but I thought, eh, it would probably not be that interesting. I am happy to be proven wrong.
    _________

    I am aware of a couple of contentious TLM chapels in the state of Morelos, but I am unsure as to whether they are 100% in communion with the Church.

    Joe of St. Thérese makes a good point: the Spanish translation, like all others, is much better than the English one.

  17. Anthony says:

    What i sthe Braga usage?

  18. Royce says:

    Anthony,

    The Braga Use pertains to the Archdiocese of Braga and is of roughly Gallican heritage. There is probably something written about it in Archdale King’s works.

  19. Derik Castillo says:

    Gracias a Dios

  20. Rudy of CC says:

    The people of Guadalajara, Mexico, are very blessed to have Fr. Romanowski. On his way to his new assignment, he stopped in Corpus Christi, TX. He said Mass Friday, Saturday and Sunday. He is a very blessed preacher. It was moving to hear him say Mass. I deeply appreciate our 2 priests who say the TLM in Corpus Christi, but Fr. Romanowski is a very impressive young man. God bless him.

  21. Fr.Fern says:

    In Tijuana we have daily the Low Mass and some Sundays when we have the visit of a good Schola cantorum the Sung Mass.Also with the Birgitine Nuns we have the missa cantata in the ritual mass of the religious profession.The nuns arranged the altar for ad orientem mass celebrations Novus Ordo and T.L.M.

  22. Edgar Fernandez says:

    Thanks Father Z for helping us diseminate this new apostolat that the FSSP is staring in our city. I also agree with Father Angel’s point of view that as the Novus Ordo has been implemented in our country without much of the craziness I have seen in other parts of the world, becaue of that Mexicans tend to view it as a real progress as they still find enough reverence in it and as they can understand the words the priest is saying without having to read a missal. Also I believe there is still a lot of ignorance as many people still think latin and the TLM (along with gregorian chant) were banned after VII so we at Una Voce have a lot of work to inform and educate both the laity and priests about the TLM and the Motu Propio.

    As far as mariachi masses I have only seen them at weddings (never in a regular weekday or sunday mass) as mariachi musicians are generally paid professionals and most churches wouldnt have money to paid them anyway. They do bring marichis into the basilica for the December 12th but that is more as a “Serenata” to the virgin following an old but still alive custom to bring live music to the balcony of a beloved women (wife, mothe or girlfriend) .

    As far as communion in the hand it is not allowed in any diocesis (as a rule) but if somebody (normally an american) asks for it the priest or communion minister will give it to him but again the rule 98% is communion standing and in the tongue.

    Please help us pray for the success of this new FSSP apostolate so that it may flourish in Guadalajara and later on expand to other cities in our country.

    If you want more information you can visit Una Voce’s website at http://unavocemx.org/

  23. Brian says:

    Last December, the rector of the cathedral in Mexico City announced the of the old Latin Mass at that church. Does anybody know the times? Please e-mail me at oneel@sbcglobal.net. I’m going on pilgrimage there and would love to see this form of the rite at that beautiful “catedral.”

  24. Martha says:

    It is my privilege to be in contact with the Benediction Father in Cuernavaca. (As well as with another dear priest) He had asked me to pray for the growth of the Old Mass in Cuernavaca, and I have been praying my heart out for his intentions; and for the intentions of my other dear Father. When I return to Mexico, I would like to be able to bring the Trad-minded priests down there some vestments. If there is anyone who would be able to supply some fiddlebacks, please contact me at: Doctorvici AT hotmail.com The Fathers will send you their appreciation.

    (I hope this appeal will meet with your approval, Father Z.)

  25. Dan Hunter says:

    Does anyone from Quatamala know if the Gregorian Rite is being offered in Antiqua, The old capital?
    Gracias.