More blah blah from the Holy See about the antics surrounding the Amazon (“walking together”) Synod… Amazoniana Synod… cha cha cha…
We’ve seen the photos of the ubiquitous carving of the pregnant woman, which is pretty obviously some sort of pagan thing. Now an official of the panamazoniana walking together party has made a helpful, clarifying statement.
[Just… “life”. Right.].- Fr. Giacomo Costa, a communications official for the Amazon synod, said Wednesday a wooden figure of a nude pregnant woman, which has been present at events related to the synod, is not the Virgin Mary, but is instead a female figure representing life.
“It is not the Virgin Mary, who said it is the Virgin Mary?” [I sure didn’t!] Costa said Oct. 16 at a press conference for the Amazon synod, a meeting taking place in the Vatican Oct. 6-27 on the ministry of the Church in the region.
Costa referred to a controversial image of a female figure which was part of a tree-planting ceremony in the Vatican Oct. 4. The same figure has been present in the vicinity of the Vatican at various events happening during the synod, under the “Casa Comun” initiative. [On a side note, I was with a group of writers recently, one of whom affirmed that that infamous and very obvious male carving made another apparition, but with a significantly reduced calling card. For those who say that it was not, in fact, a… calling card…. FAIL.]
The wooden figure of a pregnant woman has been described as both a Marian image and as a traditional indigenous religious symbol of the goddess Pachamama, or Mother Earth. [Which is more plausible. Really. Think about it. Marian or pagan? You’ve seen it, right?]
When told “many people have said” the woman is a figure of the Virgin Mary, Costa added “‘many have said,’ okay, as you like, but I have never heard that.” [You haven’t heard that? Then why are you in the job you are in?]
“There is nothing to know. It is an indigenous woman who represents life,” he stated, adding that his information commission will look for more information about it, but “it is a feminine figure” and is “neither pagan nor sacred.” [Uh huh. I’m totally buying that explanation. It’s nothing, just “life”… neutral. That’s why you see it all the time.]
Paolo Ruffini, prefect of the Vatican communications dicastery, said Wednesday he sees the figure as “representing life.” [Well that settles that! HE sees it that way. Okay.]
“Fundamentally, it represents life. And enough. I believe to try and see pagan symbols or to see… evil, it is not,” he said, adding that “it represents life through a woman.” He equated the image to that of a tree, saying “a tree is a sacred symbol.” [I refer the readership to the incident with St. Boniface and an axe. Yes, a tree can be a sacred symbol. Think “Jesse Tree”, or the “Tree” of Calvary. But those are made obvious by their contexts and the tradition behind them, not to mention their being rooted in the soil of Scripture. That carved wooden thing? Nope. ]
Ruffini said that interpretation is his personal opinion, and he was not speaking as the head of Vatican communications or synod communications.
He added that “We know that some things in history have many interpretations” and he would look for more information about the image and inform journalists about what he finds out.
Cristiane Murray, vice director of the Holy See press office, added that more information about the wooden figure should be sought from REPAM or the organizers of the events where the image has been present. [Lemme get this straight. No one in the Press Office has sought information from REPAM (massively funded by German money, by the way). And no one knew what it was before it was allowed to be part of a … whatever the hell that was… in the Vatican gardens and then being seen all over the place ever since? There was no vetting of this? Good grief. Spanky And The Gang Has A Synod.]
Mauricio Lopez, REPAM’s executive secretary, told CNA after the press conference that he could not comment on the press conference, directing CNA to Costa’s remarks, as the “official spokesperson” of the Synod. [No one’s talking.]
REPAM (the Pan-Amazonian Ecclesial Network), a group backed by the bishops’ conferences in Latin America, describes itself as an advocacy organization for the rights and dignity of indigenous people in the Amazon. The network is involved in operations for the synod assembly and is one of 14 groups on the organizing committee of the Casa Comun initiative, which is promoting more than 115 events hosted by a loose network of groups, connected in varying degrees to the Catholic Church.
Okay. Now we know. It’s a pagan idol. The other day they were out in front of S. M. Traspontina dancing around this stuff.
No matter how deluded these people might be, or well-meaning, what they are doing is actually summoning demons.
Meanwhile, here’s something by Piero della Francesca that doesn’t scream PAGAN WORSHIP. His Madonna del Parto.
Overshadowed by the Holy Spirit, she becomes the New Ark.
And he is not slithering in through a crack in the window, but into the open arms of the Vatican.
The interesting thing to me, is that while they seem deathly afraid of stating what the figure is, they won’t fail to constantly have it present as a talisman. But it’s front and center, seemingly everywhere. That the proverbial powers-that-be allow this tells me that I shouldn’t be curious, but rather deeply suspicious of what they say, do, don’t say, and don’t do.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t this a case of damned if you do and damned if you don’t? I struggle to recall *any* instance of a holy image of Mary where she isn’t clothed, and my instinct is that such an image would be sacreligious in the extreme. On the other hand, if the image is either an image of “mother earth,” of just representative of “life,” as is claimed, isn’t that pagan idolatry at its most blatant?
Why not remove the pregnant amazon woman, and replace it with a skull, as many of the saints kept on their desk, and let that remind the Synod fathers that their life will end, and they’ll experience a judgement which won’t come from “mother earth”?
In the video I saw of the event in the garden, those who presented the images to the Holy Father also made the Sign of the Cross.
I didn’t see if Little Dude was presented to the Holy Father.
Consecrate the Amazon region to Our Lady of Guadalupe… but I bet no one there will suggest that one.
“…his information commission will look for more information about it, …”
I’m either going to laugh or cry over this. I’m leaning toward laughter.
—>what they are doing is actually summoning demons.
Yes, and thank you Fr. Z for saying that.
I have an interest in Comparative Religions and what happened in the Vatican garden reads as an initiation/consecration ceremony of some sort.
One of the indicators that this is spiritually poisonous, is that nobody has ripped this stuff down and smashed that idol. Rome is filled with orthodox and faithful who are repulsed by this. Should have been smashed by now. That indicates that this stuff is being supernaturally protected.
Part of the problem in dissecting this is that there is real paganism and then there is this claptrap hybrid of paganism and mid 20th century New Age Universalism.
From the World Council of Churches website. https://t.co/MmelK1C6IW?amp=1
Indigenous leaders insist that mission be envisioned as including both the biblical tradition as well as the Indigenous wisdom in order to praise God and encompass Indigenous beliefs of the Creator as around us in all time and all places, especially in the feminine manifestation of the Pachamama.
If one starts digging into the actual pagan worship of Pachamama, one starts to see the darkness of authentic fertility cults and demonic worship immerge. There are reasons why you see the red stomach on the idol and you have pictures of the woman nursing the piglet. Fertility cults are ancient and nasty things. Evangelizing the Amazon requires rooting this stuff out and preaching Christ.
I repeat my question from an earlier post, which garnered some humorous responses, but no concrete, serious suggestions:
How should we react if we see those little Amazonian idols popping up in our own parishes? Do we just walk out of the church as soon as we see them? Scoop them up and trash them (risking arrest for theft / vandalism)? Take a photo and write to the bishop? It could very well happen (cf. the increasing prevalence of the gay pride rainbow flags).
rhhenry, Someone in our parish put out a candle with Santa Muerte on it and our pastor let it be known in no uncertain terms that the figure was demonic and if he saw another one he’d smash it. We haven’t seen Santa Muerte since.
These people must take us for idiots – as if people don’t know that across various forms of paganism, fertility goddesses are a thing.
AND…it’s funny that the same people downplaying infanticide among the Amazonian cultures are suddenly interested in LIFE being represented at the synod.
Lurker 59 says: One of the indicators that this is spiritually poisonous, is that nobody has ripped this stuff down and smashed that idol. Rome is filled with orthodox and faithful who are repulsed by this. Should have been smashed by now. That indicates that this stuff is being supernaturally protected.
Do you mean “preternaturally protected”? “Supernatural” refers to what comes from God.
That the idols have not been smashed need not necessarily indicate preternatural protection. It could also indicate effeminacy on the part of Catholics.
One wonders at the conversation that led to the greatly reduced calling card, humorous to imagine.
We used to be educated by our church, but thankfully we have Fr. Z and here, Lurker, who rightly states how demonic and pagan this all is. At the Synod there were pagans who confirmed the ceremony and idols are pagan. WHAT is our pope doing presiding at a pagan ceremony with pagan (demonic) idols? Blessing them and the participants and false idols. I think all Catholics should ask that and care very much about this. Just what religion is this. It is most definitely not Catholicism.
It is a real wonder no faithful Catholic grabbed all those pagan knick knacks and paddywhacks and kicked them into the street where they belong.
Michael Hitchborn and Taylor Marshall dig into the origins of the Amazonian liturgies, and the identities of some of the Amazonian “martyrs” being honored before altars in Rome.
They bring up an interesting tie to Fatima and the Vatican gardens.
The two pregnant statues are apparently supposed to represent a sun goddess and a moon goddess who conceive without the aid of males.
Does the Vatican really think that they can at the same time parade around the pachamama idol in various ceremonies, and give it pride of place in front of Francis at the Synod, and expect us to believe that they have no idea what the thing represents? If it’s that important that they need to bow down before it in the Vatican gardens, they sure know what it is.
This whole thing is a crock. It’s not Our Lady, we don’t bow down and worship her. So it’s ether a pagan goddess or “Mother Earth.” And if it is either of the two, it is idol worship.
Nobody wants to put the blame on anyone else. But if I found that thing in my church, I would burn it in the parking lot for all to see. Everyone would know I don approve of false gods.
I have been reading Jeremiah for the last week or so. Now, more than ever, we can identify with his great anguish. How hard it is not to slip over the edge into despair on seeing the same chapters of salvation history play out over and over in the story of humanity. I never imagined I would see such a thing in modern times. Have they no fear of God to bring the images of ancient fertility deities with great ceremony into a consecrated church and within the Vatican itself? Israel and Judah were banished with great suffering and bloodshed for this very thing. It remains to be seen how far this emergent abomination will be allowed to progress within Holy Mother Church. It is already full blown in the secular pop culture–just not generally personified in a graven image.
JPII kissed a Koran and he got canonized, just saying. The time of protest was during the first Assisi farce decades ago, if not earlier. The lack of a massive uprising when a Pope KISSES THE HOLY BOOK OF A SATAN-INSPIRED SECT makes everything we’re seeing now just the logical results of the past. I think that, even if every faithful Catholic withheld every penny for the rest of our lives, the official apparatus of the Church would continue just fine, as far as they’re concerned, without us. There’s enough governmental money and enough lukewarm Catholics (or worse) to keep the thing financially afloat and that’s all they care about. Writing a new Mass with Protestants leads to Koran kissing, and Koran kissing leads to this. I tremble for the future…what sacrilege will we see out of the successor to Francis’ successor?
(Sorry for the lack of paragraph breaks; the mobile site doesn’t allow moving the cursor around to break it up.)
They bring up an interesting tie to Fatima and the Vatican gardens.
While watching the podcast I recalled hearing that the tree planted in the garden was a holm oak, the species in which Our Lady of Fatima appeared to the shepherd children. I don’t think Michael and Taylor mentioned it in their discussion about what went on in the garden.
I did find several links to news articles naming the tree as a holm oak. We need to be aware of the possible significance.
“And Abiam slept with his fathers, and they buried him in the city of David, and Asa his son reigned in his stead. So in the twentieth year of Jeroboam king of Israel, reigned Asa king of Juda, And he reigned one and forty years in Jerusalem. His mother’s name was Maacha, the daughter of Abessalom.
And Asa did that which was right in the sight of the Lord, as did David his father: And he took away the effeminate out of the land, and he removed all the filth of the idols, which his fathers had made.
Moreover he also removed his mother Maacha, from being the princess in the sacrifices of Priapus, and in the grove which she had consecrated to him: and he destroyed her den, and broke in pieces the filthy idol, and burnt it by the torrent Cedron:
But the high places he did not take away. Nevertheless the heart of Asa was perfect with the Lord all his days: And he brought in the things which his father had dedicated, and he had vowed, into the house of the Lord, silver and gold, and vessels.” 1 K 15:8-15
I was scrolling slowly down this article, and up came the Madonna del Parto. I was hoping it to be the painting of Mary beating the demon with a stick. I love that one.
He did name what it was: “a female figure representing life.” Why is that so hard to believe? We are pro-life Catholics, correct? Therefore, a representation of a pregnant woman should be beautiful to us, not threatening.
This synod is going way out of its way to discredit itself. The whole pontificate increasingly has the feel of an accelerating late stage crack-up.
Certainly we should know more about who, exactly, the “female figure” is, and with what she is pregnant. The Virgin Mary pregnant with our Lord is different from Pasiphae pregnant with the minotaur.
I am reminded of William F. Buckley, Jr.’s comments about pushing old ladies. As I remember it, he imagined a man pushing an old lady out of the way of an oncoming bus. He then imagined another man pushing an old lady into the way of an oncoming bus and spoke of the illegitimacy of referring to both men as, simply, “old-lady pushers.” Context matters.
Why do we need a figure to represent ‘life’ in the house that holds He who represents Eternal Life?
It’s true, as @JesusFreak84 says, that JPII was very ambiguous in a lot of his gestures and even his (many, way too many) words. And JPII did create the personal cult of the Pope. However, we shouldn’t be looking for blame here, if only because this stuff was in motion long before JPII was Pope and even before VII. Actually, probably since the founding.
The question is what we are to do. I’ve given up hoping that any of our bishops or cardinals, aside from the rather marginalized handful that has already done so, will respond to the challenge and defend the Faith.
This was clearly a pagan idol, it has nothing to do with life (except in a primitive sense, because the red globs and streaks are supposed to be menstrual blood and there is a moon-worshipping component to this), and it should not have been tolerated anywhere near the Vatican. Much less worshipped by Franciscans and venerated by the Pope, who bowed to it and now has a black version sitting in front of him every day at the Synod.
So what do we do? Who could ever have imagined this scenario?
In all friendship, the fertility cults of the bronze age, and long before, almost universally had a nude. full figured, heavily pregnant woman as the image of their fertility goddess, across all cultures and geography, including the Americas. One of the oldest was found in Austria,the Venus of Willendorf, and is thought to be over 20,000 years old. Ashtoreth, who figured so prominently in the sins of ancient Israel, was the goddess of the productive forces of nature. To pretend this ancient figure is just an image of a pregnant woman is like saying , God forbid, that the cross is just two pieces of lumber perpendicular to one another.
The Devil has access to our imagination. He loves it when foul images are planted therein, because he exploits those images to corrupt us, manipulate our thinking, and/or to blaspheme God and Our Lady, using our minds. (Btw, this is why he loves pornography.) These red-zucchettoed wolves have planted the picture in our minds of a disrobed Mother of God. They perpetrate that image using this horrid little idol, and by making supposedly idle suggestions, pretending it wasn’t them that said it. The more they can link these two images in the minds of everyone, the more pleased they are; as we have seen, they revel in every opportunity. This is nothing less than a direct attack on the purity of the Virgin. Why no decent-minded God-fearing cassock-robed son of Our Lady has not already leaped to the defence of Our Beautiful Mother against this vile insult and summarily removed this degrading offensive revolting object, defeats me. Our Blessed Lord was stripped of his garments: is Our Lady to suffer the same? Are we all just going to stand by?
You have raised an interesting distinction between having access to our imagination and being able to “read our minds”, which the books I have read claim our Enemy cannot do.
Here is a recent relevant piece from the FSSP:
Angels in Five Minutes
Very interesting point. I had the same thought. It is apparently a common species in the Mediterranean region. Still, the holm oak is specifically mentioned in accounts of all the apparitions at Fatima (excepting the August apparition that didn’t occur at the Cova da Iria). Our Lady always appeared above the same small holm oak. Also, the anniversary of the Miracle of the Sun is October 13th, smack dab in the middle of the synod. And yes, Pope Pius Xll witnessed on several occasions a phenomenon similar to the the Miracle of the Sun; each time he was walking in the Vatican Gardens in the days leading up to his defining/declaring the dogma of The Assumption of The Blessed Virgin Mary. Lots to ponder there…
First few sentences in Wikipedia (I know, but still … lots of citations):
All they had to do was look it up beforehand.
@ Charles E Flynn
Thank you, and thanks for the link. To be fair to me, I did say, ‘using our minds,’ not ‘reading our minds,’ where the thought I had behind that was that he was using our minds as a field in which to plant foul ideas, in the hope they would fester there, sort of thing. Anyway, thanks again for the great link.
Of course the Fertility Goddess Totem which has become symbolic of the Amazonian Synod is being fetishized, along with the indigenous people themselves by the Baby Boomers in attendance. It’s gross how little concern for these people and their salvation there is by those in attendance and their hangers on. They would rather fetishize these people and use them for an excuse to enact their pet projects that have nothing to do with those who live and the Indigenous in the Amazon.
The Pachamamma image which was venerated in the Vatican Gardens matches very well the description in Robert Hugh Benson’s “Lord of the World” of the idol which the Masons placed on the altar for compulsory worship
Unified Reply Roundup
@Anita Moore, O.P.(lay) ““preternaturally protected”? “Supernatural” refers to what comes from God.”
I’ve seen both, but yes you are correct that is what I mean. God is clearly permitting it and by it, I mean a demonic influence that is preventing what should have been ripped out of there by now. It would be interesting to hear from those in Rome as to what kept them from acting.
My opinion is to, if one has the ability, bin pagan idols that start appearing. That said, I would like to hear the opinion of one of the exorcists that Fr. Z knows because there is a difference between a depiction of a pagan deity and an actual consecrated idol.
Yes. They are treating us like idiots and their “we don’t know exactly what is going on” is laughable because anyone with an elementary school level of education in mythology can clearly and plainly see what is going on.
Thanks. I don’t through around “demonic activity” lightly. There is a real difference between the pagan worship of Jupiter/Zeus (especially of later antiquity) and the worship of the Bacchus in its fertility cult aspect. There is pagan worship and then there is the worship of Baal. This Pachamama stuff is the latter.
I would argue that it is worse than what you are saying.
While St. JP II kissing the Koran is an act that should be disdained at least as highly imprudent, it doesn’t necessarily follow that respecting what is true in another religion leads directly to permitting and participating in pagan demonic rituals. What has Athens to do what Jerusalem? Quite a lot actually. Let me put things another way: The problem with Trek Prime, Disney Star Wars, New Who, is not in the attempt to recapitulate the respective mythologies for the present generation but rather in the injecting of “woke” concepts foreign to the mythologies into those universes. Aggiornamento, and positive ecumenism are not a guarantee for paganism, just as accepting the teaches of Athens did not lead to the Church becoming pagan (contrary to Tertullian’s concerns).
It is actually worse than “it follows that..” for this is all a conscious act in rejecting Christ. There are a million things in the Christian study and practice of Comparative Religion, sociology, comparative religion, Christian social action, that should have prevented those pagan ceremonies from occurring. It happened because there was a conscious act to go against the Christian understanding of those fields of study and modes of action.
There was a decision to actively participate in pagan worship and, tell me I am wrong, “enthronement” of that idol at the Synod and at S.M. in Traspontina.
No. Pagan fertility cults especially those tied to pre-history (aka primitive cults) are decidedly not pro-life. These deities are deities of both life and death (or are bound/twinned with a death deity) and they are just as much, if not more, about death and decay than life. It is not properly a “circle of life” but more properly that in order for there to be life there must be death. It is a demonic inversion of Christ’s sacrifice. (The Church Fathers speak about this at length when they write against the pagan mystery cults of their time — largely contemporary descendants of those fertility cults).
Yes. The level of pandering to the “myth of the noble savage”, display of pseudo-science/sociology, and utalitizing of indigenous persons that is on display is staggering. It is embarrassing in exactly the same way as how (intentionally) poorly made the pagan idols and propaganda banners are. There is a lack of unprofessional quality that is also underlined by the participants being encouraged to not wear proper attire. Catholic social scientists have enough time being taken seriously and this is just setting things so far back.
Keys to interpreting the pagan rituals taking place in Rome:
Sorry for all the links, but people need to understand that we are not dealing with harmless felt banners and playdough statues made by children. The rituals that took place in the Vatican Gardens, and then various other churches including St. Peter’s, are antithetical to Christianity.
The Pachamama could rightly be described as the enemy of the Blessed Virgin Mary. The Pachamama appears to inhabit the underworld, is often described as a snake or dragon, and desired sacrifices to keep her from causing earthquakes and death. Contrast this with the image of Our Lady of Guadaloupe who stands upon the moon, crushing the serpent with her foot, and is clothed with the heavens, and who prays for an end to human sacrifice. The Pachamama is honored on the first Friday of the month (the ceremony in the Vatican Gardens took place on the first Friday of October) and her “feast day” is August the 1st, but all of August is dedicated to her. The feast of the Immaculate Heart of Mary is on August 22 in the old calendar.
Revelation 12, the promise of the triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, the words of Lucia about the devil wanting to engage in a definitive conflict, and the Rev 12 constellation in the sky in Sept of 2017 during the 100th anniversary of Fatima all come to mind.
We must redouble our efforts to become holy, stay confessed, pray for poor sinners and the Church, and fulfill Our Lady of Fatima’s requests.
Contrast the image of the Pachamama with the image of the woman in Rev 12, laboring to give birth, and it is easy to see that we are dealing with the Church, and a false, mirror image of the church, an antichurch. The woman in Rev 12 is about to give birth, and the Pachamama statue crouches, pregnant, in the position that most primitive cultures used for childbirth.
The fact that the Pachamama was venerated in the Vatican Gardens, in St. Peter’s, at the outset of the synod, sends a disturbing image of a false church being born or created, with an ancient deity from the underworld laboring to bring it forth.
A woman is a symbol of life.
A tree is a symbol of life.
But the first symbolic tree to come to mind got a particularly prominent woman in a Hell of trouble, if you’ll pardon my saying so – something about being like gods, knowing for themselves good and evil.