READER REACTION: “My first inclination is, ‘Really? On the Feast of Our Lady of Mt. Carmel?'”

From a reader…

A couple of thoughts on this great Feast of Our Lady (sigh) …..

My first inclination is, “Really?” On the Feast of Our Lady of Mt. Carmel? It seems so disrespectful to co-opt her Feast day in this way…….. Yet, I find a certain comfort in it; it’s as if Our Lady has intercepted this document, and is telling us, ‘Don’t worry; I’ll handle this one myself.’

Second thought: Mt. Carmel is at the tip of St. Michael’s Sword; is this action a tipping point? Perhaps; I don’t know.

Also, in the children’s vision at Fatima, didn’t they see an angel (St. Michael?) who was about to touch the tip of his sword to the world, and Our Lady stopped him? ………. Recall that Francis had his papacy consecrated to Our Lady of Fatima the day after his election.

Third thought: Your recent post that reminded us that the idol was displayed/reverenced in the Church of Our Lady of Mt. Carmel in Rome.

Today someone quipped to me that Traditionis custodes is translated as Pachamama’s revenge.

If anyone thinks that what we saw today was not an important development in the spiritual battle raging around us – more and more – you are bizarrely, unaccountably naïve.

We will all do well to invoke the the intercession of the Mother of God, Our Lady of Mount Carmel, in this time of need.  I ask her, especially as Queen of Priests, to obtain many graces for her sons in Her Son’s priesthood that they do not lose heart.

POINT OF FACT: Several priests who contacted me who do NOT say the TLM, do not know how, are now more resolved than ever to learn it and use it.

I don’t think this legislation is going to have the result they think it will.

And let us not forget to bring this to St. Joseph, Patron of the Universal Church, Terror of Demons.   This is a special year for Joseph and we should be bringing our petitions to him.   I ask him, on top of continuing to help me with material support, which I now need more than ever, also to guard and protect His beloved Jesus’ priests as he himself protected the infant and growing High Priest.    St. Joseph, help me and help all priests now.

About Fr. John Zuhlsdorf

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  1. Jones says:

    What a wonderful time to be alive.

  2. donato2 says:

    I’m picking myself up and dusting myself off. No Christian worth his salt lets the prospect of Mass in the catacombs discourage him. They have the numbers but we have the devotion.

    It is however still hard for me to wrap my mind around what has happened. A Pope has chosen to attack the oldest and purest tangible form of Catholic tradition. With a Pope like that, who needs enemies? Not even the eastern bloc Communists dared to so coercively suppress the Mass.

  3. TonyO says:

    I think the expression is: Molon labe

    We should be arming ourselves. But this is a spiritual fight, so we should be using spiritual warfare methods. Prayer and fasting, especially. What better prayer than…the prayer of the Church for 1500 years +? You know, that one, said by the saints who were priests, and assisted by the saints who were laity.

  4. JSzczuka says:

    You cannot win, Darth. If you strike me down I will become more powerful than you can imagine.

  5. Elizium23 says:

    I do not believe that a battlefield mentality is useful here. The Holy Spirit never wills a civil war within Christendom; the Holy Father and our bishops are not the enemies.

    “Katniss, remember who the real enemy is!”

  6. kurtmasur says:

    Speaking of Star Wars, I can’t help but think of that scene in which Han Solo is tied up and frozen in carbonite. Summorum Pontificum is Han Solo. It can always be unfrozen ;-)

  7. Gab says:

    Surely it cannot be legal to do this to the Mass of Pope St Pius V?

  8. Pingback: SATVRDAY EDITION – Big Pulpit

  9. NEIL ADDISON says:

    The only small glimmer of light I can find in the new MP is that even though it says that Bishops cannot form new Personal Parishes for the Traditional Mass it doesn’t stop Traditional Mass Shrine Churches being created.

    The ICKSP and FSSP churches in the North West of England are all technically Shrine Churches without geographical boundaries. There doesn’t seem anything in the MP preventing Bishops creating new Shrine Churches run by one of the Traditional Orders

    That said I’m hopping mad at what Pope Francis has done I go the TLM on Sunday but happily attend the OF Mass during the week or when I’m on holiday. I accepted the legitimacy of both but now I feel the Pope is forcing me to make a choice between them. He has created division where none was needed Summorum Pontificum was achieving what Pope Benedict wanted namely to bring the various wings of the Church together and Pope Francis has kicked that noble aspiration in the teeth

  10. Mike says:

    I’m going with one of my sons tomorrow to a TLM in the DC area. I’ll report back on what I see and hear.

    I feel like it’s 1970. I was 9 years old then. Zero memory of Church affairs. (I do remember the guitars, “To Be Alive!”).

    Francis just put us in the way back machine. I guess our job is to remind him it’s 2021, post-JPII and Benedict XVI, the internet-age, and man, we’re not falling for any of this garbage.

  11. Bob says:

    I’m not sure about the reaction to this around the Catholic world but is the rest of the Catholic Church outside the USA reacting as strongly against Traditionis custodes as the Church in America?

  12. Semper Gumby says:

    Elizium23: “I do not believe that a battlefield mentality is useful here.”

    Well, we are the Church Militant. Charles Martel, St. Joan of Arc, the books of Joshua and Revelation indicate that there are times to “Cry havoc, and let slip the dogs of war.” And…”Ye shall hear of war and rumors of war.”

    That said, we also read in the Letter to the Corinthians: “I will show you a better way.” Which means: a crowded check-out aisle on a hot day need not turn into Gotterdammerung; the gutters need not overflow with torrents of blood after a failed attempt at parallel parking; and a dispute in the sandbox over a toy pony need not turn into a knife fight.

    “The Holy Spirit never wills a civil war within Christendom…”

    Right. We’re Christians with free will, common sense (er, usually) and Just War Theory. We are not playthings of the gods, battling up and down the Greek peninsula while Zeus, Ares and Hekate lounge about in a drunken stupor. Nor are we Twelver Shi’a spending the days mining uranium and the nights soldering multi-colored wires hoping to immanentize the eschaton and force the Glorious Return of the Hidden Imam.

    But, the Better Way also means some things are worth dying for. Cheers.

  13. TonyO says:

    Someone help me out here. In the very first article of the “actionionable” items in TC, Francis says:

    Art. 1. The liturgical books promulgated by Saint Paul VI and Saint John Paul II, in conformity with the decrees of Vatican Council II, are the unique expression of the lex orandi of the Roman Rite.


    I am not trying to be belligerent here, just trying to OBSERVE. And the observation is that what he said is erroneous. And manifestly so, it doesn’t take canon law or a degree in theology. Or even a high-school education. He EXPLICITLY PERMITS the use of the older missals (within certain constraints). Therefore, the Novus Ordo missal is not the “unique” expression of the lex orandi of the Roman Rite. The term “unique” does not mean “main” or “primary” or “best” or “preferred”, it means the SOLE example. Permitting the pre-1970 missal means the 1970 missal is not the sole missal. I am just observing what the terms mean.

    Arguably, he has also not forbidden other uses, such as the Dominican, etc, (at least, if they have immemorial custom behind them, which they do). Hence they continue in the Roman Rite.

    Now, perhaps (I am trying to be charitable and weight all options, here) he means the phrasing “is the unique expression” as an aspiration: it SHOULD EVENTUALLY BECOME the unique expression of the lex orandi of the Roman Rite. OK, but if that’s the case, it’s not an action item in the sense of a command to be obeyed. An aspiration is not an order. In fact, the whole of Article (1) does not carry a command in any clear sense at all. So, it isn’t really an action item.

    Another alternative for what he might means by “unique expression” is that the Novus Orde missal is “unique” in the sense that it is the SOLE missal of the reform requested by Vatican II. Or that it is “unique” in that there is no other mass like it. Well, it is indeed the sole NEW missal approved after Vatican II, but even Missale Romanum permitted the old missal to be used in certain cases, so it is not the sole missal that HAD APPROVAL for use after 1970.

    And it is arguably NOT the missal of the reform of Vatican II, because it clearly defied many of the points called for by the Fathers: it’s not merely a “not very GOOD” attempt at carrying out reform of VII, it is a missal that rejects what VII called for. So, while it is, yes, unique in that it is like no other mass, the rest of the sentence doesn’t represent a “truth” that is actually, you know, true.

    And even so, it does not command, it is an assertion.

    I wonder, does the pope get these things reviewed before he issues them? Or does he just do them on his own.

  14. NEIL ADDISON says:

    In reply to Bob I can assure him that this Motu Proprio has aroused a LOT of reaction here in Britain its even been mentioned in Secular newspapers and news channels. The ICKSP and FSSP have been quietly extending and developing here and it’s my hope this will continue notwithstanding Pope Francis

  15. Elizium23 says:

    Well, we are the Church Militant.

    Yes, we are the Church Militant. Pope Francis is the Church Militant. Cardinal Cupich, Father James Martin, SJ, Nancy Pelosi, Rodrigo Duterte, Raul Castro, Cardinal Burke, Bishop Fatty McButterpants, we are all the Church Militant.

    And what do we militate against? Sin and death.

    If you are trying to tell me that the Magisterium would support an interpretation of Just War Theory that would focus it on internal, disciplinary, largely political and gossip-based strife, then I would tell you that that is offensive to pious ears.

    The Church accomplishes her mission through charity, cooperation, accompaniment, understanding, works of mercy. She does not engage in gossip, back-stabbing, calumny, rash judgement, or polemnics. If such things are used against us, we turn the other cheek, and resort to the same charity, cooperation, accompaniment, understanding, and works of mercy.

    Canon 1373 of the 1983 CIC applies.

  16. Kathleen10 says:

    Elizium, respectfully I suggest it is exactly the right time for a battlefield mentality, and all must be part of it. “Put on the armor of God.” If not now, when.
    The action of Francis is an action against God. It is far more likely to increase interest in the Traditional Latin Mass and make it grow exponentially.

  17. Semper Gumby says:

    Elizium23: “Pope Francis is the Church Militant.”

    Prove that Bergoglio SJ is the Church Militant.

    “Cardinal Cupich, Father James Martin, SJ, Nancy Pelosi, Rodrigo Duterte, Raul Castro, Cardinal Burke, Bishop Fatty McButterpants, we are all the Church Militant.”

    Prove it.

    “And what do we militate against? Sin and death.”

    That’s insufficient. Think about it.

    “If you are trying to tell me that the Magisterium would support an interpretation of Just War Theory that would focus it on internal, disciplinary, largely political and gossip-based strife, then I would tell you that that is offensive to pious ears.”

    Prove that “focus” was demanded.

    Prove that it is “offensive” to all “pious ears.”

    “The Church accomplishes her mission through charity, cooperation, accompaniment, understanding, works of mercy.”

    Prove that the Church “accomplishes her mission” only through those methods. Prove that the Church never successfully employed other methods.

    “She does not engage in gossip, back-stabbing, calumny, rash judgement, or polemnics.”

    Of course not, people do.

    “If such things are used against us, we turn the other cheek, and resort to the same charity, cooperation, accompaniment, understanding, and works of mercy.”

    Prove it. Also prove that these were the only methods used in the past. And, of course, prove that these will be the only methods employed in the future.

    “Canon 1373 of the 1983 CIC applies.”

    Expand your thinking…what else applies here.

    One of your many errors here is utopianism.

    The road to hell is paved with bromides, to salvation with hard sayings.

  18. Josephus Corvus says:

    Just thinking….

    Option 1: They can’t form new personal parishes. However, if they already have ONE they are good to go. Just implement what has been going on with regular parishes in many diocese throughout the US. Multiple parishes merge into one parish but have multiple “sites”. All they have to do is make sure that the merge is done properly such that the second parish is merged “into” the existing one, rather than create a new parish. Right?

    Option 2: TLM Masses can’t be held in the parish church, but can be held in the rented beer hall, right? A supportive bishop could close a church and decommission it, but instead of selling it to the whoever, it is now “just a hall” owned by the diocese and can be used for whatever they want. Just so happens that this non-parish hall is now used for the holy form of the Mass…..

  19. oakdiocesegirl2 says:

    Elizium23: No battlefield mentality? I beg to differ. The entire history of the papacy is littered with popes and antipopes. It’s been awhile since we’ve had that scenario, but it just may be on the horizon. I don’t see a modern day Catherine of Siena available to talk this pope into returning to the real world from his NWO. Ever hear that the blood of martyrs is the seed of Christians? Sometimes those martyrs were martyred by Catholic hierarchy. And I would not include fallen away Catholics like Pelosi on the list of Church Militant. Some who wear the Catholic label are mere imposters.

  20. yeager says:

    Does Francis have the authority to abolish the TLM? Does a pope have this right?

  21. docsmith54 says:

    The beginning is almost conciliatory, but the MP’s end is surely an ‘Et tu, Brute?’ moment.

    Any bishop who spoke as against TLM isn’t worth a lick.

    Vigano sees catacombs. Benedict saw a reduced Church. Now, tell me: which of the two forms was in need of revision? The practices under NO make priests into performers and not shepherds; make the attendees involved in unapproved way (oran’ position).

    It will be reversed when Francis leaves the scene (five years.) Sooner or later.

    I pray for the Office.

  22. docsmith54 says:

    BTW can someone tell me the justification for Pope St John 23 calling Vatican II? What heresy, what dogma, what doctrine, what conflict? If Siri was installed after his election, none of this would have happened.

    To ‘bring the Church into the modern world’ is woefully inadequate.

  23. Orual says:

    Besides having this awful Moto Proprio released on the Feast of Our Lady of St. Carmel, it was also released after one of the worst years Catholics have faced in my lifetime. We just spent a year of churches shut being down, sacraments being cancelled or restricted, limited capacity at mass, and wearing masks. Finally, after more than year of this madness, most parishes are fully open and functioning and the Pope responds with …. more restrictions!!! Another scorpion for his children when they needed a fish! Just awful!

  24. Semper Gumby says:

    A helpful piece on St. Michael’s Sword:

    This St. Joseph site looks interesting:

  25. Semper Gumby says:

    St. Michael is in the news the last several days.

    Several days ago Black Rifle Coffee (Evan Hafer and Mat Best, former Army and CIA contractors) sat down with the New York Times (the wisdom of that meeting is highly debatable).

    An excerpt from the NY Times article:

    “Hafer and Best were talking in a glorified supply closet in the Salt Lake City offices, where potential designs for new coffee bags were hanging on the wall. One of them featured a Renaissance-style rendering of St. Michael the Archangel, a patron saint of military personnel, shooting a short-barreled rifle. In Afghanistan and Iraq, Hafer knew a number of squad mates who had a St. Michael tattoo; for a time, he wore into battle a St. Michael pendant that a Catholic friend gave him. But while the St. Michael design was being mocked up, Hafer said he learned from a friend at the Pentagon that an image of St. Michael trampling on Satan had been embraced by white supremacists because it was reminiscent of the murder of George Floyd. Now any plans for the coffee bag had been scrapped. “This won’t see the light of day,” Hafer said.”

    A number of things are going on here. First, Hafer and Best are known for outlandish, funny and inspiring but at times simply over-the-top videos. (Hafer is quoted as saying they try to be “irreverent.” Well, “irreverent” has been done for decades, any fifteen-year old with a YouTube channel can do irreverent. In 2021, given the situation foreign and domestic, perhaps it’s time for Black Rifle Coffee to move past that youthful urge and accomplish something enduring. That takes time, but they have the raw talent.)

    Second, Black Rifle Coffee, one could say, tacked to the starboard side of politics (though there were eyebrow-raising donations to anti-2nd Amendment leftist politicians, and Black Rifle has thrown a temper tantrum during a disagreement over Kyle Rittenhouse) until last year, when they tacked back to port. That type of political behavior by a company is familiar, and, as we have seen in 2020-21, now threatens the Constitution.

    Returning to St. Michael. Hafer and Best, relying on the infamous, anonymous “friend at the Pentagon” have “cancelled” St. Michael by surrendering to their fears and to a desire to be liked. One wonders what is the political and religious agenda of this “friend in the Pentagon” and why Hafer and Best did not have the fortitude to stand their ground. Hafer and Best are encouraged here to be not so easily swayed by every pop culture and political ruckus and adopt a long-view of events.

    Their appeasement of the mob is unfortunate, and is yet another indicator of the wide gulf between the Black Rifle “brand” they enjoy presenting and the actual behavior of Black Rifle Coffee management.

    Hafer and Best are reminded that St. Michael is the patron saint of paratroopers. Persevere.

    Hafer and Best should also consider a sit-down with Marty Skovlund, the editor of their magazine “Coffee or Die.” Here is what their editor wrote several weeks ago:

    “It seems everyone on Twitter (and other social media platforms) is all riled up about CRT, either strongly for or against it. Honestly, I haven’t heard anyone talk about it in real life. It’s almost like people only feel strongly about it exclusively online. Hmm.”

    Well…that is quite a display of ignorance, easily rising to the Useful Idiot level. Black Rifle Coffee, now willing to virtue signal early and often to leftist media, should review the abundant videos of actual American parents of all, all skin colors who are upset their children are being indoctrinated by radicalized schoolteachers. Empathy. If you doom children to years of anti-American and racist indoctrination for your own short-term profit, then you, gentlemen, are Lost.

    One last word. There is a bond between military veterans, particularly combat veterans. That bond can be broken by criminal behavior (e.g. John A. Walker of the Navy and Harold J. Nicholson of the Army and CIA) or by reckless behavior.

    For many, many veterans the bonds of God and Country, the instincts of protecting children and nurturing something enduring, are stronger. Spiritual and situational awareness, gentlemen, spiritual and situational awareness. Good luck and God bless.

  26. Elizium23 says:

    It would seem that we have interlocutors who deny the efficacy and indelible ontological character of Christian baptism. Pity.

    [The only thing this incoherent non sequitur suggests to me is rash judgment.]

  27. Semper Gumby says:

    Elizium23: By your logic Benito Mussolini and Adolf Hitler were members of the Church Militant. Be advised they rejected the Faith. When brandishing your “ontology” in the future try to remember Common Sense. Cheers.

  28. acardnal says:

    Elizium23 wrote, “The Church accomplishes her mission through charity, cooperation, accompaniment, understanding, works of mercy. ”

    You forgot how it primarily accomplishes her mission: by preaching the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

  29. Semper Gumby says:

    acardnal: Good point. And in the New Testament there was plenty of barracking…fraternal correction.

    Luke 22:

    24 A dispute also arose among them, which of them was to be regarded as the greatest. 25 And he said to them, “The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and those in authority over them are called benefactors. 26 But not so with you; rather let the greatest among you become as the youngest, and the leader as one who serves. 27 For which is the greater, one who sits at table, or one who serves? Is it not the one who sits at table? But I am among you as one who serves.

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