UPDATE:
I had a call from a friend who underscored her real shock at Martin’s ghastly suggestion in his tweets. The more I think about it, the more loathsome the true content of Martin’s tweets appears.
He told people that they shouldn’t pray or do penance. The underlying message is that their prayer and penance would not be effective, that their prayers and penances wouldn’t help or do anything.
How twisted is that?
Originally Published on: Sep 18, 2018
One Mad Mom is one mad mom!
She tackles, as well as anyone could, something deeply deceptive that homosexualist Jesuit James Martin, LGBTSJ, said.
In full disclosure, I am one of those leaders who call for the laity to do penance and make acts of reparation for the sins of priests. Now that I know that Martin thinks it is a bad idea (actually, he is doing something far more slithery), I know that I am right.
Fr. Martin – Don’t Be That Guy!
Only from the mind of Fr. James Martin, LGBTSJ, can we get this shocker. I had another post all tee’d up but this one deserved a response.
I understand the desire among some church leaders to call for the church to fast and pray in response to the sex abuse crisis. It’s a recognition that we are all the Body of Christ, the People of God, united as one, in Christ’s name. And we are all called to prayer. However, in this case, to imply that the laity, in any way, should perform any kinds of penances, including fasting, is simply wrong. The laity should not have to do one minute of penance for the crimes, sins and failings of the hierarchy and the clergy. And yes, we are all one, but it’s important, especially in this case, not victimize people all over again. To use the model of the sacrament of reconciliation, it is the sinner, the one seeking forgiveness, who repents, not the one, or ones, sinned against.
Put your eyes back in your head. Yep, he actually said that. It was so fantastical that I screenshot that puppy for you. Oh, Fr. Martin, where in the heck is the Catholicism in this three tweet rant? Sorry, Blessed Mother. All of those times you urged us to prayer, fasting, and penance to hold back God’s wrath and drive the evil out of the world, well, you were wrong. Oh, and your spot at the foot of the Cross was useless, since you were free from sin. Not your problem. And Apostles, you wasted your time, too. Please, please, tell me that even some of the Fr. Martin groupies cocked their head at this one!!!
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Jesus was innocent too. I guess that whole “die to save us from sin” was a bad plan?
If you don’t even believe the fundamentals of Christianity, why are you working as a priest, Fr. Martin?
Satan has liked that post and will likely be retweeting it repeatedly though his lackeys of course.
At what point do we pull his Catholic card? I admit, I can do penance, and fasting for the abuser priests easier than I can for Fr. Martin but he needs it every bit as much, maybe more. His appeal to only do what we feel we have to do if it is agreeable to us is par for his course. It is the reason he is such a proponent of homosexuality. If you can’t win with intellect, appeal to their feelings. PUKE
I presume that Fr James will not be doing any prayer or fasting as he has not committed any of these sins.
I pray the Divine Mercy chaplet with others who choose to join me on Friday at 3 pm, in reparation for sins against children and young people, and in reparation for sins against chastity by the clergy. No imputation of sin or guilt against us who pray, although I am indeed a sinner
May God have mercy on us all.
When our Lady of Fatima appeared six time, she smiled just once. When? After the children had been exhorted many times to “make sacrifices for sinners” and they used a piece of rough rope to make a sacrifice. After that, our Lady smiled and said: “God is pleased with your sacrifices … but he doesn’t want you to wear it during the night.” What a prudent Virgin Mother! She encourages heroic and selfless charity in little children while also teaching them moderation.
It’s this episode that made me realize why Pope Pius XII called Fatima’s message a re-affirmation of the Gospel: Jesus commands us to love one another as He does. How’s that? By sacrificing yourself for sinners.
This truth is appealing to courageous souls. To a lady I know who expressed interest in becoming Catholic I asked what it was that interested her and appealed to her about Catholic faith. She didn’t even hesitate saying: “The spirit of sacrifice.”
I am going out on a limb and say that I think this has to do with a natural kind of gut reaction that some sex abuse victims have to the calls for doing penance for the perpetrators. Fr Martin seems to be taking a stance of accompanying them and seeing it from where they are at. The response of a person I know who was sexually abused (NOT by a priest) to the call for penance was that it seemed unfair she a victim would be asked to do penance for those who have sexually victimized others. It FEELS like it goes against what victims are told: “it wasn’t your fault”. And if it’s not your fault then you are not the one who deserves to be punished… so a request to do penance creates confusion in them because it is like the guilt is imputed to them and it’s on them to make up for the sin. Indeed it might take some advanced amount of healing and a lot of grace to have that much mercy to not only be able to pray for but even do penance for those who have done things that have caused you personally so much harm. It obviously goes beyond what is obligatory, for anyone to do penance for others, it goes beyond justice, to Mercy. But for Christians freely (not under compulsion) to do this is involved, mysteriously, in how God wills to restore Charity that has been so wounded. Christ “shouldn’t have to” die on the Cross for sinners; He did so freely because it was His divine prerogative to have that much Mercy and Charity. By realizing that we are FOLLOWING HIM in what He has gone ahead of us to do, what we are with Him, participating, that He is accompanying us and we are accompanying Him there is a sweetness that can even be found, of transcending being a victim, of finding Love.
Oh dear. It seems this announcement comes rather late as my Parish KofC council has already made plans for a Holy Hour of Adoration in Reparation. The bulletin has already been printed and distributed this past Sunday, so there is absolutely nothing that can be done to stop it at this point. Oh well, come to St. Stanislaus Church Nashua, NH Wednesday 9/19/2018 7-830PM.
Sadly, Fr. Martin has been *invited* by Abp Wilton Gregory to speak at parishes in the Atlanta Archdiocese. People are rightly upset by this. See: https://georgiabulletin.org/news/2018/09/thought-provoking-jesuit-author-to-present-at-two-local-parishes/
Fr. Martin’s biblical illiteracy is so glaring, it should disqualify him from having any sense of influence in matters Catholic, let alone Christian.
The premise that fasting would only be practiced within the context of the model of the sacrament of Penance is false. The early apostles practiced communal fasting for the intentions of Church leaders (Acts 13:3-4, 14:23). Jesus fasted, and was free of personal sin. He also recommended fasting as a complement to intercessory prayer for others (Mark 9:29). There are other examples, but you get the idea.
I think he’s party afraid that penance and prayer will work. Penance and prayers don’t only offer reparation, it also leads to conversion. Why would he want anyone to have anyone to amend their lives. And I’m not referring to the victims or perpetrators but the ordinary people who are in his movement.
When a priest denies the power/ necessity/ the impact of prayer and penance, something is seriously wrong.
In August of 2017 Our Lady of Fatima said: “pray much and make sacrifices for sinners, for many souls go to hell because there is no one to make sacrifices for them.”
But he may be among those who think apparitions are fairy tails for children. I’d prefer to “become like a child” and believe like a child, because Our Lord’s promise of heaven is for them alone.
WHEN will he be silenced by the Church. He is doing more harm than good but especially as a Catholic Priest he should be definitely NOT be putting out his own opinions as the Church’s opinions. How totally inappropriate and dangerous. If anything I hope this cause MORE to pray, fast and sacrifice for this whole mess.
Why is this fraud not following his real vocation?
There is an urgent need for Uber drivers somewhere.
It’s not really so surprising, is it? The battle has been joined, and Martin is at best (really, for his sake, at best) a useful idiot of the opposing side, yelling “Lay down your arms” to those on the side of the angels.
Does he not realize that this is “ASKED OF US” NOT forced on us. No one in the Church is being forced to fast or sacrifice for sins they did not commit. We are asked to undertake this prayer and sacrifice out of love for our Catholic Church. We are asked to DO and not to count the cost. When was sacrifice, prayer and fasting ever harmful when done with love and care for Our Church?
God PLEASE have Mercy on us and on the whole world.
@ElizabethD It’s true but I think it’s pretty cool that God has made it so that the guilty person relys on the victim’s prayers and sacrifices for his own salvation. The debt!! I hurt Johnny but the only reason that I’m able to get to heaven is because Johnny helped me. It’s the opposite and the anti-dote to scandal.
Aside from the biblical illiteracy I commented about prior, it should be noted how much Fr. Martin undermines Vatican II and its teachings on the common priesthood of the baptized and that of the universal call to holiness. The Council noted the value of works of penance and sacrifice outside of the context of the sacrament of Penance, but as voluntary acts which the laity take on for their own sanctification as well as that of others.
On the common priesthood of the baptized:
“They likewise exercise that priesthood in receiving the sacraments, in prayer and thanksgiving, in the witness of a holy life, and by self-denial and active charity.” (Lumen Gentium 10, emphasis mine)
“They are consecrated for the royal priesthood and the holy people (cf. 1 Peter 2:4-10) not only that they may offer spiritual sacrifices in everything they do but also that they may witness to Christ throughout the world.” (Apostolicam actuositatem 3, emphasis mine)
“Finally, the laity should vivify their life with charity and express it as best they can in their works.
They should all remember that they can reach all men and contribute to the salvation of the whole world by public worship and prayer as well as by penance and voluntary acceptance of the labors and hardships of life whereby they become like the suffering Christ (cf. 2 Cor. 4:10; Col. 1:24).” (Apostolicam actuositatem 16, emphasis mine)
On the universal call to holiness:
“Indeed, in order that love, as good seed may grow and bring forth fruit in the soul, each one of the faithful must willingly hear the Word of God and accept His Will, and must complete what God has begun by their own actions with the help of God’s grace. These actions consist in the use of the sacraments and in a special way the Eucharist, frequent participation in the sacred action of the Liturgy, application of oneself to prayer, self-abnegation, lively fraternal service and the constant exercise of all the virtues.” (Lumen Gentium, 42)
I really try to no be a complete cynic, but the cynical side of me is batting a thousand these days.
I am confident to a level of a scientific certitude that never in Fr. Martin’s 11 years of religious formation was the concept of reparation for the sins of others ever mentioned.
Further proof that education cannot be confused with knowledge.
He told people that they shouldn’t pray or do penance. The underlying message is that their prayer and penance would not be effective, that their prayers and penances wouldn’t help or do anything.
How twisted is that?
Pure Protestantism.
And overtly heretical.
These people have neither the honesty nor decency to leave the Church, and we have a Pope who lacks the clarity and courage to formally and definitively pronounce them as heretics excommunicated and uncatholic, even though by their actions and false teachings they have made themselves so latae sententiae …
I hope to do a 4000 km Pilgrimage from my Parish and back again, via Fatima, Compostela and Lourdes, as a Rosary of Reparation and Penance and as a Request for Forgiveness and Mercy and the ridding away from us of these ghastly Heretics , and against the sort of vile spiritual and moral cowardice proposed by this awful man.
I have ordered a copy of the Breviary as established by Pope Saint Pius V for that purpose.
richiedel :
Aside from the biblical illiteracy I commented about prior, it should be noted how much Fr. Martin undermines Vatican II and its teachings on the common priesthood of the baptized and that of the universal call to holiness
These are excellent points — Martin is of the so-called “spirit of the council” ; not at all of the Council itself.
JabbaPapa:
Yes, I am starting to feel as if the “spirit of the Council” has outlived its usefulness for many as an excuse to do whatever they feel like in AND outside the liturgy. They at least used to pretend to care about Vatican II insofar as its “spirit” could be invoked, but not anymore…
JabbaPapa,
And, I would also note that it’s interesting how deference to the laity is invoked by certain people when the laity’s “lived experience” can be useful for the development of doctrine, but when as in this case the common priesthood of the baptized is being elicited by bishops to offer prayer and sacrifice for others, the laity can just keep those prayers and sacrifice to themselves, thank you very much.
It is very strange to me the distinction in his tweets between “the laity” and “the clergy”. As if only the entire body of the clergy should pray and do penance (including himself, I suppose), but not “the laity”. I do not think this aspect of the tweets is even Protestantism, that would not emphasize the distinction between clergy and laity in that way. That seems to be pure, cheap and bad “clericalism”.
I wonder if he has read the life of so many saints who did a lot of prayer and penance for the entire Church. If we follow the ideas behind these tweets, many Canonizations should be re-evaluated, because these saints were praying and doing penance also for the sins of others, which is “simply wrong”.
I wonder what Maria Goretti would say to Fr James Martin?
I let my son know I fast for him. He tells me not to. I do anyway.
The very funny thing here is that Fr Martin contradicts – brace yourselves – Pope Francis!
In his “Letter to the People of God”, Pope Francis asks for fasting and penance: “To see things as the Lord does, to be where the Lord wants us to be, to experience a conversion of heart in his presence. To do so, prayer and penance will help. I invite the entire holy faithful People of God to a penitential exercise of prayer and fasting, following the Lord’s command.”
The words “penance” and “penitential” are used no less than six times in Pope Francis’ letter; the word “fasting” comes six times too (including one in the footnote).
I am not surprised that Fr James contradicts ? Pope, but I am surprised that he contradicts ???? Pope.
Fr James contradicts also the Vatican II: “Therefore the Church announces the good tidings of salvation to those who do not believe, so that all men may know the true God and Jesus Christ whom He has sent, and may be converted from their ways, doing penance. To believers also the Church must ever preach faith and penance…” (SC 9).
__________
Everyone, throw away all modernist wishy-washy junk and feast yourselves on this:
“Now, whosoever of the faithful have piously pondered on all these things must need be inflamed with the charity of Christ in His agony and make a more vehement endeavor to expiate their own faults and those of others, to repair the honor of Christ, and to promote the eternal salvation of souls. And indeed that saying of the Apostle: “Where sin abounded, grace did more abound” (Romans v, 20) may be used in a manner to describe this present age; for while the wickedness of men has been greatly increased, at the same time, by the inspiration of the Holy Ghost, a marvelous increase has been made in the number of the faithful of both sexes who with eager mind endeavor to make satisfaction for the many injuries offered to the Divine Heart, nay more they do not hesitate to offer themselves to Christ as victims. For indeed if any one will lovingly dwell on those things of which we have been speaking, and will have them deeply fixed in his mind, it cannot be but he will shrink with horror from all sin as from the greatest evil, and more than this he will yield himself wholly to the will of God, and will strive to repair the injured honor of the Divine Majesty, as well by constantly praying, as by voluntary mortifications, by patiently bearing the afflictions that befall him, and lastly by spending his whole life in this exercise of expiation.” (Pope Pius XI, MR 18) (The Encyclical itself is about reparation).
I have noticed over many years that our priest does not give us (or him) a moment of silence to contemplate our sins. And he will never — and I mean never – has us say the confiteor. Could it be that he is afraid of exposing sin to our hearts and then afraid to confess??? His reticence has always bothered me. What’s wrong with me?
teomatteo, does the priest also not use these other options ?
—
Option B
Lord, we have sinned against You:
Lord, have mercy.
Lord, have mercy
Lord, show us your mercy and love.
And grant us Your salvation.
Option C
Lord, You were sent to heal the contrite.
Lord, have mercy.
Lord, have mercy.
Lord, You came to call sinners
Christ, have mercy.
Christ, have mercy.
Lord, You plead for us at the right hand of the Father.
Lord, have mercy.
Lord, have mercy.